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How To Respond To Girls Who Call Out Game

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theprivateman
on August 30, 2012 at 1:27 pm
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She mentions the Strauss book?! Red Pill wisdom will evolve faster than women can figure out. Besides, who cares what they say? We all know it’s the actions that should be followed.


  • nathanwyatt
    on August 30, 2012 at 2:17 pm
    Original Link

    Exactly.

    Particular techniques out of Neil Strauss or wherever are to sex what a slapshot or spin move are to ice hockey.

    Game is to sex what experienced, trained play is to ice hockey.

    Who would be surprised or somehow alarmed to observe that developing a heightened aggression and technique is basic to high-level ice hockey success?

    Panicking over “oh she knows my Neil Strauss!!!!!” is like Alex Ovechkin worrying that his opponents have seen a slapshot before. It just doesn’t make any sense to red pill types.


    • YaReally
      on August 31, 2012 at 1:28 am
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      Good analogy. Well said!


  • christianplayer
    on August 30, 2012 at 2:31 pm
    Original Link

    It’s all about comfort. If it makes you get uncomfortable, you lose. If you are comfortable, you win.


    • YaReally
      on August 31, 2012 at 1:32 am
      Original Link

      Yep. Dead on. PUAs call this concept “what you feel, she feels” and it underlies a TON of other game concepts (like say if you’re peacocking you’ll get shit-tested…if the tests make you uncomfortable, she’ll think you should be uncomfortable, if you blow thru the tests and feel awesome, she’ll think you’re awesome).

      Very important concept. Women and betas react to their environment and ping off it to figure out how to feel. An alpha male is unreactive and self-amusing and doesn’t ping off anyone else for how to feel.



Tyrone
on August 30, 2012 at 1:39 pm
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I game my wife all the time. She reads this blog and thinks she has game figured out. They don’t even recognize game if it’s done right.


  • Anonymous
    on August 30, 2012 at 5:36 pm
    Original Link

    Even women who are aware that such a thing as game exists still don’t know what it means. For example friend of a friend comments that kids are learning game at an early age, then explains that a sweaty nervous16 year old kid in the grocery store told her she had nice eyes. That is womens perception of what game is. Betas complimenting them.


    • YaReally
      on August 31, 2012 at 1:39 am
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      lol also this.

      In the Gossip comments I described an AMOG tactic I’ve used a bunch that plays off the gossip concept. You think ANY girl in a million YEARS would be able to spot what I’m doing in that move, or even grasp how over-arching the move is and how many variables it covers at once and how long a duration of time it covers etc? Especially IN the moment? lol it would terrify them to get a glimpse at how in-depth real Mystery Method style pickup can be.

      Meanwhile to the guy who asks “hey where’s the bathroom?” she’ll say “what is that a neg?? That’s a neg isn’t it i know all about your “game” I read Neil Strauss!!! Get lost you player!!!” and she’ll high-five all her grrrrl-power friends and come on game comment sections and say “you guys don’t get how smart we girls are, we can spot you a mile away and will call you out instantly! Like this one time where a guy asked where the bathroom was–” like the retarded chick in this comment section doing exactly that lol


      • Anonymous
        on August 31, 2012 at 5:01 am
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        Understood.

        But it looks bad if bitches are now angrily waiting to reject guys for using indirect openers on them.

        That sounds like nuclear scorched earth policy.

        Most of us can’t get anywhere unless an innocent open ended question gets answered with some IOIs or with the woman qualifying herself as an interesting person, thus allowing the guy to suggest she’s earned more attention.

        So a more relevant question here would not be whether American women are now “on to game” so much as:

        Are more American women now cynically and arrogantly ready to see indirect opens, such as requests for directions, as attempts by men to meet them and seduce them?

        And, if so, are these women prepared to shoot themselves and the men in the foot by reacting with hostility to the indirect contact or, worse, ignoring the men entirely?

        Alternatively, and this could be a good thing, are American women more tuned into the idea that a man asking for directions is at least possibly interested in her and she should do more than just give the answer and keep on walking if she could be the least bit interested?


        • YaReally
          on August 31, 2012 at 12:33 pm
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          “And, if so, are these women prepared to shoot themselves and the men in the foot by reacting with hostility to the indirect contact or, worse, ignoring the men entirely?”

          Nah, they just act hostile because when they picture someone running game on them, they picture a sleazy creeper guy. If Brad Pitt asked “Hey, who do you think lies more, men or women?” you think they’re going to be like “pfft, get lost loser!!”? lol

          It comes down to higher-value. The same happens for us. A fatty fat saying “that’s a nice shirt” makes us think “ugh this is my lamest shirt, this gross chick is just trying to fuck me”, but a smokin’ hot 10 saying it makes us think “wow this is my lamest shirt so she’s probably just making that up but fuck it she’s hot!! :)

          That’s why you can’t really listen to women when it comes to what’s going to work or not work for game. When they start a sentence with “If someone did that to ME, I would–” it’s them picturing a super creeper doing it.

          That’s why worrying about this is all moot if you’re intermediate+ with game…it’s just rough on the newbies because they’re the ones that are going to go up and use routines and get called out because their vibe is weird. But there’s no fast fix for this, the way you learn to calibrate is by fucking up and analyzing your fuck ups until you fuck up less and less lol



JS
on August 30, 2012 at 1:42 pm
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Right, a womam saying don’t use game is actually saying, don’t have a personality that I find attractive.


  • YaReally
    on August 31, 2012 at 1:44 am
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    lol this is the irony they don’t get. They should want guys to learn game.

    Tyler describes it well, he says basically “Learning game isn’t creepy. You know what’s creepy? NOT learning game. Because you think guys without game will just NOT approach? No, they’ll still approach, but it’ll be in this creepy lame awkward uncultivated weird way.”

    But it pisses girls off because they had a very clear system of who’s alpha and who’s beta before and now with game we can take a beta they’d have ignored and make him look like an alpha they want to fuck so suddenly they can’t trust their senses anymore.

    Ideally down the road the beta who looks like an alpha will stick to his training and eventually BECOME a legit alpha, but during that transition period there’s a whole lot of “omg I can’t believe I’m fucking this girl she’s so hot and she has no idea I’m a total nerd hahahaha” lol



A.B. Dada
on August 30, 2012 at 1:48 pm
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If you allow a woman to switch into logical mode (i.e., Man mode), you’ve lost.

Switch her to emotional mode and it won’t matter if you pulled a book out in front of her and tested things out.

Hamsters = hormonal emotional mode
Shit-talking mouths = logical man mode

Don’t deal with a woman’s attempt at masculine logic. She is not your equal there, and her hamster will fight her own brain for superior positioning. Stroke that hamster out onto the wheel.


  • Anonymous
    on August 30, 2012 at 3:24 pm
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    There was a thread on reddit where a woman posted a message she received on a dating site which she said made her laugh. In the comments section some tried valiantly to point out that it was a copy and pasted message from some forums and that the guy probably spammed this to many women. To the chagrin and confusion of the commentators, she actually didn’t care because she found the message entertaining.

    I’m certain there was an older Chateau post on how women will sometimes be aware of game but still not mind it because they enjoy it.


    • YaReally
      on August 31, 2012 at 1:47 am
      Original Link

      “I’m certain there was an older Chateau post on how women will sometimes be aware of game but still not mind it because they enjoy it.”

      This is another reason not to bother denying game. I know she’s wearing a push-up bra and makeup and heels and shit and she doesn’t really look like that when she rolls out of bed on a Tuesday, but do I care and want her to not do herself up for me? Fuck no.

      Think of how silly it would be if she was like “no these are my real eyelashes, this is how I really look by default, this isn’t makeup!!”. That’s what denying knowing about game looks like when you’re clearly running game.



Anon
on August 30, 2012 at 2:01 pm
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War of the sexes is not a war anymore. Game made it so asymetric that it’s now ridiculous. Game versus shit tests is like AK-47s versus machetes.

We will sooner or later start hearing some women begging for mercy, and asking to negotiate terms of capitulation.
And if that doesn’t happen, well, we will keep fucking this nation to oblivion like many civilizations before us.

No big deal, really.


  • YaReally
    on August 31, 2012 at 1:51 am
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    It really is over-powered. I’m always 10 steps ahead of interactions. I know what she’s thinking before she does and I know what she’s going to do before she does it. Game really gives you a sense of god-like omnipotence when you’re on fire with it.

    It doesn’t mean you always get the girl, but you can usually pinpoint exactly where things went off track because you understand the situation so well and can calibrate better in the future.

    This is part of why we encourage guys not to get shit-faced and game. Most of this goes out the window when you drink and your brain and memory aren’t as sharp.



Highlander
on August 30, 2012 at 2:37 pm
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To really see how to handle this in action, just watch Hank Moody in the Californication series. It’s the best I’ve ever seen in the media.


  • YaReally
    on August 31, 2012 at 12:49 am
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    Hank’s game is dead on solid. Especially in the first 2 seasons, mostly in the 3rd season, but from there it all gets pretty retarded and the show falls more into ridiculous situations.

    When the show first came out all the MSM was like “this is just some writer’s wet dream, girls throwing themselves at Hank and sleeping with him right away, it’s all bullshit!” but the first 2 seasons and most of the 3rd are legit if you understand game.

    Even the Porsche sales-chick, there’s teasing, cocky-funny, leading all in the store, then AMOGing and social proof when he burns the guy in the other car, etc. it happens quickly but the principles are there if you know what to watch for. Not saying that kind of thing happens all the time, but it’s not as crazy and far-fetched as the MSM railed against it. The funny part to me was how ANGRY they railed against it. Like it made them mad to watch the show lol



Ian Ironwood
on August 30, 2012 at 3:08 pm
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How about some of these?

“Yeah, you’re right. Game only works on pretty girls.” Walk away.

“Neil Strauss? How quaint! Really, Cupcake, if I wanted to get in your panties I’d be there already. I’m just trying to get your friend jealous. You never approach the prettiest girl first.” Walk away.

“Neil Strauss shit? Please, I’m better than that. I’m just a chubby-chaser, and you look like you’re gonna balloon up in a couple of years and I wanted to meet you now. But I can see you’re reluctant . . . ” Walk away.

“Yeah, you’re right. You’re clearly not worth the effort.” Walk away.

(Wide eyed) “But . . . But . . . everyone I talked to said that you were the easiest chick in town, and all I had to do . . . oh, I see. You went to the clinic this week, didn’t you?” Walk away.

Seeing a pattern, Gentlemen?


  • YaReally
    on August 31, 2012 at 12:53 am
    Original Link

    ya the pattern is you being completely butt-hurt and going home to lotion and kleenex.

    These are terrible and not just pointlessly mean but actively burning down a completely workable set.

    “sorry, we don’t have any pepperoni pizza right now.”

    “fuck you then!!! BURN THIS PLACE TO THE GROUND!!!!!”

    To quote Anchorman: “boy, that escalated quickly.”



Graham
on August 30, 2012 at 5:29 pm
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Sometimes I feel like the timing on this blog is uncanny.
Last night was flirting with a 7 from London at some lounge downtown, in the middle of the conversation she asks if I’ve read “The Game”. My immediate reply, naturally accompanied with a shit eating grin, “Obviously not, otherwise I wouldn’t have forgotten to have negged you.” Ended up spilling vodka cranberry on her later (It was free haters) but she surprisingly wasn’t mad at all. Was going to go for the number close but realized she was only here for a week so I moved on towards better prospects.

Same place this NYU sophomore that I’d just met (who’s actually in the same program as me) asked me to grab her a drink. Mid-way through her sentence I cut her off – are you actually trying to get me to go grab you a drink? Her response – maaaybee. Me, smirking – Well I guess it’s too bad that I have asshole written all over me.

I was going to go for the number later but lost her when I forayed into the bathroom to do a little blow (I probably should have invited her along but that’s backfired in the past).

Did number close two coke whores though.

But enough keyboard jockeying. I’m just glad to have stumbled across the generous denizens of this chateau and know what I do as 19 year old.

On a more serious note, do any of you adults out there think I shouldn’t be fucking around with drugs and basically soulless people at this age? I’m around coke and in “good” clubs basically 2-3 nights a week. I think of you all as mentors to a certain extent, and sometimes I wonder if I should just start dating a nice girl to attain some level of stability in the dark existential abyss residing where my soul used to be. Alas I’m finding my social circle is just too damn jaded and cynical (to be expected from wealthy club kids) to make that happen.

I had been seeing a 6.5ish gf material girl for a bit but basically used her to make an ex jealous. I let things fall apart.

As one female friend put it, “She was nice Graham. But you’re polar opposites. You belong to the dark side.”

And now I really must get going. I have to return some videotapes.


  • YaReally
    on August 31, 2012 at 2:08 am
    Original Link

    If you build an assosciation between doing coke and being “in state” (having fun, running game, etc), eventually you’ll train your brain to require coke to get into state.

    We do this to ourselves all the time in harmless ways (like needing a beer with your nachos to really enjoy the nachos, someone gives you a Pepsi and you’re like “wtf? :( this sucks”) but coke is a pretty dangerous dependency to build so be careful.

    If you want to do it, at least force yourself not to do it till after you’re in state (ie – you’ve opened a few chicks and gotten a couple numbers or makeouts) so that your brain doesn’t learn to depend on it to get into state.

    I’m not your dad and I’ve never done coke so I’m not going to lecture you on not to experiment with it, but most of the top PUAs live a pretty healthy lifestyle: healthy eating (paleo diets and greens and shit), taking vitamins, working out, no drugs (at least not while gaming, recreational time is different for some of them but definitely no hard drugs, generally it’s just some weed with buddies vs like, shooting up heroin lol), and a lot of them don’t even drink alcohol or only have a couple drinks instead of getting hammered. A lot of them do drink, but usually not when they’re teaching boot-camps and stuff.

    Part of it is that to go out regularly, especially as you get older, you need to take care of your body (you’re exposing yourself to a lot of germs and staying out late and shit so if your body gets run-down from alcohol and bad food etc. you get sick all the time). But another part of it is just respect for your body and psyche. Self-improvement is about taking care of yourself and minimizing self-destructive habits.

    But I’m sure that at 19 none of that is really a big concern for you lol so just be smart about the coke stuff and don’t get sucked into the coke scene too far. If you stick with learning pickup you’ll meet a lot of people, especially in the high-end rich social circles who are dependent on coke because their lives are pretty much empty and too easy, especially girls, and it’s pretty sad to see.



nomennovum
on August 30, 2012 at 5:53 pm
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“She’s in the 8-9 category …”

An 8 – 9 girl who says game doesn’t work on her, huh? Well I, for one, believe what she says.

You see, what she really wants is a man with some “charisma who is comfortable in his own skin, has a good sense of humor, is confident, unflappable, charming, fearless, exciting to be around, and has that certain ‘je ne sais quoi’.” That’s it.

You see? That’s not game.


  • YaReally
    on August 31, 2012 at 2:12 am
    Original Link

    lol’ed. Fuck, if only there was a way to learn how to be some of those attractive things girls like!!



Adam
on August 30, 2012 at 7:03 pm
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I’d just play stupid. Not dumb, stupid.

Me: Like a Strauss Waltz? But I like Classical Music. Just the masters though, Bach, Beethoven, Mahler…

Her: No, I mean The Game.

Me: Is that a book, a movie?

Her: Its a book that tells men how to pick up women.

Me: …does it work?


  • King A (Matthew King)
    on August 30, 2012 at 9:17 pm
    Original Link

    Why play anything? What are you afraid of? You are doubling down on concealment, as though it would be disastrous to be exposed. I don’t get it. I don’t understand the lies within lies.

    I didn’t read the book, but I know all about it because I visit pick-up blogs and they’re smarter than you think. In fact — believe it or not — they’re one of the few places anywhere that doesn’t engage in abject bullshit. So what’s your point, little girl? Let’s try some of it out on you right now… It’ll be a blast…

    Either defend your principles openly, or get new ones. Don’t run from a fight. Step into it.

    It will be a short fight with a girl. I promise. Neil told me in his chapter on “shit tests.”

    Matt


    • YaReally
      on August 31, 2012 at 2:16 am
      Original Link

      “Why play anything? What are you afraid of? You are doubling down on concealment, as though it would be disastrous to be exposed.”

      I actually agree with this outlook. The example you give is really socially awkward and uncalibrated but the mindset you’re describing is a solid one.


  • YaReally
    on August 31, 2012 at 2:15 am
    Original Link

    You’re in her frame when you do this. That’s not a bad thing that you can’t recover from, just be aware that you’re letting her define the interaction when you do this, so be ready to cut the conversation thread and actually game her instead of getting stuck in this for too long.



King A (Matthew King)
on August 30, 2012 at 9:02 pm
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How is getting “called out” even an issue? To regard this as criticism implies you are nervous about being exposed. You cannot escape the nagging fact that it is the height of nerdery to learn how to flirt from books and blogs.

Treating simple wisdom as a secret to be guarded contributes to my theory that pick-up is more a cult than a practical discipline.

Women don’t want to know how magic tricks work. They aren’t curious little boys taking apart the lawnmower when dad’s gone just to see how it runs. They want to be delighted. We are the masters of substance and process; they are preoccupied by appearances and surfaces. Nietzsche: “Women aren’t even shallow.”

Women want to be seduced by you. They should be flattered by the attention and count themselves lucky you made them a target. If they don’t, work on the “you” part. If they are driven to wondering about the hows and wherefores, a distinctly unfeminine mental process, you have no aura and no chance. You are so clunky that you inspire a girl to contemplate science. If you are showing your seams badly enough for her to recognize your routine as a routine, you need more than a quip to deliver you.

I would discuss game with girls if they weren’t so instantly, naturally bored by shop-talk. They think they’re living in a romance novel, not a text book. You don’t talk with women, you act upon them. They are your willing, even excited guinea pigs once you demonstrate competence.

“Don’t try that Neil Strauss shit on me. It won’t work.”

No kidding. Anything else you feel compelled to warn me about, Miss Priss? We’re about to begin.

Matt


  • YaReally
    on August 31, 2012 at 1:27 am
    Original Link

    “Treating simple wisdom as a secret to be guarded contributes to my theory that pick-up is more a cult than a practical discipline.”

    Yes that’s why we don’t encourage guys to be secret and guarded about it. It’s like you pride yourself on building strawmen and being deliberately ignorant lol

    “No kidding. Anything else you feel compelled to warn me about, Miss Priss? We’re about to begin.”

    KJ visualization. Wouldn’t work in real life. A girl busting you on game is a girl who sees you as too low value to bite on a “Miss Priss” jab and come along on a “We’re about to begin” ride. When you have higher value that kind of thing can work but if you HAD high value she wouldn’t be calling you out on using game in the first place, she’d already be receptive.

    That’s how it works when you stop visualizing scenarios in your head and leave your computer room and actually approach girls, at least lol



YaReally
on August 31, 2012 at 1:21 am
Original Link

The reason agreeing and amplifying is better than pretending not to know about the book and denying it is the same reason the asshole who makes his intent clear gets the girl while the Nice Guy(TM) who pretends not to want sex or be making any moved is unattractive. One embraces his desires and makes his intent known, the other hides it and masks it, ashamed of his desires. Girls pick up on that.

On top of it when you deny something that’s really obvious it makes you look retarded. Like the kid in your class who’d memorize jokes off the Internet and tell them like he came up with them and then when you called him out he’d deny it until you’re showing his joke already written out to him and he’s like “no what are you talking about that’s a coincidence”. It’s pretty hard to respect him after that lol

On top of ALL of this, the main issue with this whole situation and all the responses is that you’re letting her set the frame and you’re reacting to her and getting into a logical discussion with her.

I wrote my response to it purely because the guy asking wanted to know how to respond to that bit of her profile and that’s how I’d do it.

But the reality is, if I were messaging her I would ignore that part of her profile COMPLETELY and game her as normal. Same thing in real life. BradP put it best on his Underground Dating Seminar CDs:

PUA: “hey do you like horses?”
Her: “this is that BradP opener isn’t it–”
PUA: “no shut up do you like horses?”

Strongest frame always wins. What you feel, she feels. Be the cause, not the effect. Be unreactive, make her react to you. Change her mood, not her mind. These are all PUA guidelines lol

See the PUA community already went thru this discussion a thousand times. We all shit a brick when The Game came out because we were all heavily canned routine based back then and all using the exact same lines and wording. We were still looking at the surface (“say this this and this”) instead of deeper like we do now (“say whatever you want, but convey this this and this concept”).

It’s actually a big reason Tyler switched from canned to Natural game, which he’s talking about a lot and described how hard the transition was for him. But he knew “who lies more?” would become the next “hey baby what’s your sign?” and game needed to adapt.

The community tends to teach more concepts and inner-game than specific outer-game and canned routines now because of how limiting that was and to avoid these situations.

Like a few people above have mentioned, solid game should be so smooth that she can be looking FOR it and still not spot it.

Personally I like routines and shit, I think they’re a good way for newbies to get started and everyone has a handful of “go to” lines they say or stories they tell. The key, though, is to look at the structure and build your OWN routine off the structure.

So you take “Excuse me, I can only stay for a minute but I need a female opinion on something…who do you–”

What is that? It’s stopping them, getting their attention, demonstrating that you won’t hang around them all day, asking for assistance, and building some intrigue.

So “Hey! Hold up a sec. Help me out. Who do you–” is the exact same thing, it conveys all the same stuff but with different wording and a different attitude. The original way will get called out if she’s read The Game, the second way is impossible to detect.

The problem is a lot of guys getting into game are super socially awkward and don’t get all these nuances so they think “I specifically have to say these words in this order” and become robots (aka Tyler in The Game era).

Anyway, ya, PUAs have been having this discussion for like 10 years. Girls knowing about game doesn’t affect shit if your game is solid.



How To Respond To Girls Who Call Out Game

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Fausta (@Fausta)
on August 31, 2012 at 11:18 am
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I don’t know about game or no game, but it seems to me that bringing up her mom (“it worked on your mom”) is really burning all your bridges – if that’s what you’re after.


  • YaReally
    on August 31, 2012 at 12:36 pm
    Original Link

    Not if it’s true. heyooooo but that’s a story for another time.



Year One

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via Rational Male

YaReally
on August 30th, 2012 at 7:51 am
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Congrats. Yours and Heartiste are the only Manosphere blogs I’d actually recommend to guys.


Year One

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via Rational Male

YaReally
on August 31st, 2012 at 2:22 am
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“putting the manosphere ahead of commercial PUA material in moving Game forwards.”

lol well I wouldn’t go that far. The Manosphere is still light-years behind PUA, but I would say that sites like Rollo’s are responsible for helping the Manosphere make massive leaps and strides toward catching up to PUA, which is an important thing. :) it also presents PUA stuff in a more digestible format than PUA teaching, for guys who’ve just taken the red pill which is also important. It’s like the tutorial level in a videogame that makes a complicated game more accessible to the masses.


Year One

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via Rational Male

YaReally
on September 7th, 2012 at 5:47 pm
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“Which PUA things do you think are ahead of the manosphere?”

Well, let’s look at the last 5 posts of Rollo and the last 5 of Heartiste:

Rollo:

Women Studies – (women oblivious/denying hypergamy, this is just PUA’s Anti-Slut Defense and Tyler’s Secret Society concepts reworded)

Play Nice – (“nice guys” being fake, this is just Jeffy’s “Surprise, I have a penis” concept, but the notion of nice guys not being attractive because they’re hiding their true intentions goes back waaaaay into early PUA stuff, I’m too lazy to search it out and fastseduction.com where articles about that are probably located is pretty broken these days)

Girls on the Side – (game being an adaptation to a fucked up SMP that women created is just common knowledge in PUA circles, pretty much since Day 1 we’ve all known that PUA game has just been reverse-engineered and is a way of adapting and succeeding in what seemed like an unfair/impossible market)

Girl’s Night Out – (jealousy stuff, this is just PUA’s Abundance Mindset (a recent re-labelling of a concept) but the teachings of how to handle a GNO go way back in PUA stuff…fastseduction and fasterseduction has pretty much solidified into a formula the concept of using Soft Next’s and Hard Next’s to punish bad behavior, manage jealousy, reward good behavior, handle other AMOGs, whether to ask a girl how her night was, etc., etc.)

Just Get It – (this is just PUA’s “change her mood, not her mind”, and “lead the interaction” and “show, don’t tell” etc. concepts that any new AFC to the community learns about, how women won’t state or often don’t even know what they really want…it’s been long-term knowledge in the PUA community that we understand women’s desires better than they do)

Heartiste:

Asstenuating Circumstances – (a field report that basically just demonstrates frame control, a PUA concept from way back)

Your GF is Flirting With Your Friend – (basic Mystery Method social circle/group management, DHVing, AMOGing, jealousy, etc.)

(skipping the Virgin Mormon one cause it’s tl;dr to me lol)

How To Do Anniversaries The Alpha Way – (basic PUA don’t supplicate stuff, don’t reward her for no reason or for shitty behavior or just because she wants it, etc. all stuff you learn pretty much on day 1 of studying PUA)

(skipping some shitty posts)

How To Respond To Girls Who Call Out Game – (PUAs have been discussing this and testing this since literally before The Game was published, because we go through that crisis every time some game stuff goes mainstream…we did it at The Game, we did it at the theoretical movie that was going to be made, we did it when Mystery’s VH1 show came out, etc. now the community has moved into more Natural game but my point is that this brand new post is basically a PUA discussion from 10 years ago)

Women Gossip To Compete For Men – (basic Mystery Method working group dynamics juggling stuff, jealousy plotlines, playing girls off eachother, etc.)

My point isn’t that PUAs are better or anything, it’s just that 90% of the stuff in the Manosphere is just stuff PUAs have already figured out years ago, but reworded and streamlined to make it more digestible to the general Manosphere readers who aren’t going to pick up and read Mystery Method or watch the 20 hour Blueprint, but who are going to skim their favorite blog during their work lunch hour and pick up some useful tips/concepts to think about or try out.

And like I say, I think the Manosphere is needed for that. But the concepts it’s coming up with aren’t anything new if you’ve been in the PUA community for a while. Even the word “hypergamy”, which I admit isn’t a term I heard till I read the Manosphere, is basically the same concept as “women are attracted to higher value” which is a concept that goes back to the start of PUA.

“Who is nearer the cutting edge right now…. RSD / Love Systems / PUA Training etc vs Rollo, Roissy, Roosh etc.”

RSD is light-years ahead of everyone, they’re pushing the boundaries and breaking new ground. Their multiple video articles per week are all really solid (aside from their current focus on how important a wingman is, which is just marketing bullshit to sell the Inner circle club they’re starting…skip back a few pages in the Articles section to the good meaty videos).

Love Systems in my opinion is the next best group, but I’d say LS focuses more on solidifying and teaching already established concepts. I’d actually recommend a newbie start with LoveSystems, and then when they’re feeling intermediate/advances in LS’ traditional style of game, move into RSD stuff where they’re doing retarded things. A newbie trying out RSD’s ideas is going to be getting kicked out of bars and beaten up and shit lol

So basically RSD is paving new ground, LS is solidfying the old ground (not an insult, I think this is important, they’re like the guys who make the textbook for students to learn the ideas where RSD is the crazy scientist trying out ridiculous lab experiments and blowing themselves up a bunch while making occasional new discoveries). Most other companies are just taking RSD/LS stuff and rehashing it. Love the Simple Pickup guys but they’re just rewording game concepts (“being in state” = “god mode”, etc.). Other companies are focusing more on all-around “lifestyle building” instead of focusing entirely on chasing pussy, and that’s cool tool, that’s important and less “absorb your life” intense and some guys need to work on more than just their skills with women to get their shit together as men.

“The manosphere has specialised in the next big pioneering step… bringing sociology and deep social mapping into Game, grounding the work you do in-set into a sophisticated and nuanced worldview…”

I think that’s the important part of what the Manosphere does, and I think that’s part of the influence/crossover with the MRA/MGTOW crowd, which I say is a good thing. That’s how you make something more digestible to the casual crowd of men who don’t want to go out 4+ nights a week approaching girls and instead want to just improve their marriage or flirt around their office or they’re 30+ and don’t want to go to bars etc.

And that’s cool, but the concepts they’re using come from the PUA community and they’re still using the “Lite”/digestible versions of those concepts. The Manosphere has made up this whole gay “Dark Triad” concept (I think it came from SoSuave? I don’t follow SoSuave as close because they’re just White Knights trying to apply the least offensive PUA concepts as possible lol) to separate itself from the “bad” PUA concepts. I haven’t seen much in the Manosphere that’s really controversial/offensive because everything is toned down. The PUA community has some stuff in it that’s legit sociopath type shit, but from that we learned a lot about human psychology and why certain things work.

Like the post that made me start posting in the Manosphere was The Shocker post on Heartiste where BradP’s opener (from yeaaaaars ago) was brought up and analyzed and tossed aside as impossible and wouldn’t work and silly. I had to go in and explain why it works for him and even then no way anyone in that comment section was going out and trying it. To me, that’s the Manosphere still being way behind PUA tech that’s been tried and tested. So that’s why I say they’re still playing catch-up to us.

The reason I can add pages-long in-depth explanations and clarifications to pretty much every Manosphere article posted is because I have years-worth of knowledge and experience with each of the subjects because they’ve been around the PUA community since pretty much the beginning. Concepts the guys here are discussing are concepts I was taught about by the PUA community and experiencing first-hand in my first year of going out sarging.

I’d say PUAs are more like “Hey, women chase higher value, so to use that make sure you do such and such tactic”, whereas the Manosphere is like “Hey, women chase higher value, let’s explore why that is in-depth”. And that’s cool, but it’s all mental masturbation because if you were going out you’d start to understand the “why” of it yourself from experience, and the guys who are reading articles on why women chase higher value aren’t given any tools to go out and explore it with. The end result is a whole bunch of really smart guys who still aren’t getting laid. :)

“I just don’t think there’s much left to advance there and I’m not expecting any paradigm shifts anytime soon.”

I think the focus of the two is different (PUA is unashamedly about women/attraction, whereas the Manosphere is more about overall life stuff), but a lot of PUA companies (including RSD) are expanding into the “handle your life in general and be an overall cool guy” and internal game teaching too.

This video by Tyler sums it up good (good part is around 8:05):

He says the main reason the PUA community stresses going out is because we know that the field will shove all your weak points in your face and force you to change for the better. You’ll lose attraction because you have no interesting stories to tell, so you’ll go out and start getting stories and experiences. You’ll run out of breath fucking a girl because you’re a fatass so you’ll start hitting the gym. Bouncers won’t let you into a bar so you’ll start handling your style/fashion. You won’t be able to afford to go out or to keep up with high class social circles, so you’ll start to get a handle on your money.

Like to us there’s no need to tell guys to focus on that stuff because if you listen to the fundamental basic rule of PUA (“field experience is king”, “go out”, etc.), you will handle all this other shit and you’ll build all these mindsets that the Manosphere is trying to teach. The Manosphere is essentially trying to teach guys the same thing they’d learn if they just got off their asses and went out…that’s part of why it’s digestible. “Oh, I don’t have to go out and get shot down by a bunch of hot girls and have my ego stomped on until I slowly fix myself over time? I can just read this article on Rollo’s blog?? AND offer my opinion in the Comments section and argue with a bunch of other people who never go out and feel like I’m part of a club?? AWESOME!! Sign me up!!”.

I’m not playing sides or anything here, I like both “spheres”. I’m not an RSD employee or anything. All I am is a guy who’s read, studied, and practiced a ton of different styles of game and been following it for years. I can switch from Mystery’s indirect stuff to Juggler’s comfort stuff to Gunwitch’s direct stuff, and can pretty much explain everyone’s work from different periods of time. I’m like a Wikipedia of PUA shit lol I was interested in human psychology in general before I found pickup so pickup has just given me an avenue to focus that interest on. If I hadn’t found PUA stuff I’d be reading general psychology articles in my spare time for the fun of it.

I’m 100% objective and think the internal commercial fighting and stuff is all silly nonsense, all I care about is what works and what doesn’t work? Like I say, the Manosphere has an audience and even if those guys aren’t going out and getting laid, the more men who make that mental shift to the same outlook PUAs have, the better for men in general, ultimately. Especially these days where we’re being shit on left and right with “Man Up!” and “Where have all the real men gone?” articles getting so much publicity.

“BTW, you’re comments are great. When are you “doing a Rollo” and putting together a blog?”

Thanks. Never. lol I have a normal life outside of this, commenting here and there is enough for me.

“Funny seeing Tyler treat his long term girl and mother of a kids with the gruff discipline that’s talked about in the manosphere, in front of an entire goddamn conference room full of people. Some of the guys there were freaked out that he was “mean” and asked Tyler about it, so he went pretty into depth about how to manage women. All of the rest of the instructors had a very similar frame.

The thing is, they got that attitude by going out hard for 2-5 years and getting burned when they fucked up.”

Exactly this. Us PUAs know that going out will form all these mindsets the Manosphere is explaining, that’s why we don’t really bother dwelling on it. Because even if you read about the mindset, you still won’t HAVE it, as a part of who you are, it’s still in your intellectual side as a concept. By going out with tactics purposely, you forge those mindsets into yourself completely so that when you’re in the conference room with your baby-mama you’re treating her the way the manosphere explains you should treat her.

“The VAST majority of RSD’s students still do not understand it even after a bootcamp, so they STILL get burned.”

I’d say this is a problem of commercialization and general “quick fix pills” mindset newbies have now that PUA is mainstream. When PUA was still underground, only the really desperate guys found the community and they understood “this is going to take years of my life to get a handle on”. We didn’t go out for 2 months and whine “I didn’t get a BJ in the bathroom”, we were like “sweet, it only took me a year to get a makeout in the bar!!!” But now that PUA is so mainstream everyone is like “Where’s my MSN 10 Tips To Get Laid magic pill that’s going to fix me??” so they go into bootcamps thinking they can undo 20+ years of bad wiring in their brain and behaviors in 3 days. And commercial PUA companies sell it that way because, well, that’s how they make money lol But regardless of their marketing practices, the knowledge they’re dropping is legit if you go into it with the understanding that a weekend seminar isn’t going to fix you, ya know?

Like Tyler says, no one is going to buy the book titled “Lose 1lb a week over a slow period of time by watching your diet and putting in lots of work exercising and achieve your goal in just one year!” They’re going to buy the book titled “Lose 10lbs in 4 days with no work at all, eat donuts every day!!”

“(plus going out, of course) has HUGELY accelerated the learning curve of my game.”

The going out is the important part. I find the Manosphere doesn’t tend to give a shit if guys go out lol I haven’t seen pretty much a single article in the Manosphere that encourages guys to go out multiple nights/days a week and approach X number of girls and try different tactics and report the results etc. Thus the massive community of guys who feel like they’re super psychological geniuses now that they have all this “understanding”, but they still haven’t cold approached a girl this month, let ALONE taken a girl home in under 7 hours etc.

So if you take a guy who’s just broken up with his girl or whatever and is all disillusions and he finds the Manosphere but he’s never heard of PUA before, or he’s heard that PUA is too obsessive and all fuzzy hats and shit and he doesn’t want to get that in-depth into it, he sits and reads all these Manosphere articles because that’s “safer” and more digestible.

But the Manosphere doesn’t encourage him to go out at all. So he becomes another one of the armchair theorists feeling like his understanding of psychology is expanding but he still doesn’t have a social circle inviting him out on Saturday nights, he still doesn’t have a harem of girls texting him wanting to fuck, he’s still living the same lifestyle he was before he found the Manosphere.

That’s why I’m always harping on people and calling them KJs, because I can tell which guys are legit going out and which ones are just mentally masturbating. I can tell because I’ve gone out a fuck-ton and I’ve met and hang out with guys who go out a fuck-ton. :)

Aaaaand now it’s almost Friday night, so I’m about to kill a few more hours of work and then shower up and head out with two different social circles and club-hop from a grand opening of a new nightclub (a buddy got us VIP tickets) to the hottest club in our city where we’ll be able to skip the line and walk in because my group has made friends with the staff. We’ll probably bring some girls from the first place to the next, but if we don’t it doesn’t matter because we’ll be approaching girls and shooting the shit with guys and be getting new girls and making new friends.

To whoever read all this: What are YOU doing tonight? GO OUT. APPROACH. Field is king. :)


The Alpha Male Look

Original Link

via Heartiste

YaReally
on August 29, 2012 at 5:51 pm
Original Link

YaReally
on August 29, 2012 at 5:53 pm
Original Link

Hot Girl Crazy

Original Link

via Heartiste

The Shocker
on August 28, 2012 at 2:37 pm
Original Link

Re: 10′s one line I’ve been dropping lately that always gets a smile is, “So how about the men in your life. Are they mistreating you like you like?” Friendly and cool, but hints that you ‘get it.’

One thing I’m learning with HARD 10′s is to not DHV at all. I met a (non-stripping) hostess working at a premier strip club last Thursday- she flies out to Vegas on weekends to pursue her ballerina career. Blonde, gorgeous, 11/10. She liked me when we were just chatting but when I DHV’ed (HARD) I crashed and burned… fuuuck… I think they actually capped me compared to her life. Same thing happened with this SMOKING personal trainer. She told me her mom was a cop and I tried to DHV since there are a few badges in my family… nope. For some reason what’s a DHV with regular girls ‘felt’ like ‘trying’ with these girls. The GM of the strip club played it right with the hostess, he called her black swan since she was a ballerina- she called him The Vampire since he had that vibe. Should have stayed in that teasing/witty frame rather than try to go ‘real’ with the DHVs.

IMO the hottest girls actually seem more normal to me since they’ve been socialized for so long, as long as they don’t have HB8-9 syndrome where they appease insecurities via alpha sex.



jadoescher
on August 28, 2012 at 3:20 pm
Original Link

I’ve found that the worst hot crazy comes from girls that are cute and pretty, but also very approachable (either with girl-next-door looks or a friendly, warm, approachable personality) and not the Megan Fox lookalike hotties. The Megan Fox types can certainly be evil bitches, but they don’t play the head games that the really cute approachable ones do because most guys won’t approach and the ones who do tend to be alphas who can keep them in line.

The cutesy types get absolutely mobbed by guys who fall head over heels in love at first sight (mostly betas who consider the uber-hotties to be out of their league). These guys are not intimidated by her looks and warm personality, so they have no trouble approaching, but her charms, looks, and “coolness” hook the guy and he supplicates and gives away their power immediately, which the cutesy girl manipulates handily. These girls also tend to be fairly feminine, love to cook, and like children. so beta guys think they are perfect and their love is meant to be.

These girls also tend to have the greatest number of platonic guy friend orbiters, a straggler-boyfriend who she isn’t all that into (he’s kind of a loser but is at least a bit more alpha than the orbiters), and girlfriends who will encourage her behavior while simultaneously hating her guts for it.


  • sweet cherry
    on August 28, 2012 at 4:25 pm
    Original Link

    As a cutesy 7/8, I can attest that this is 100% true, especially since my personality changed recently to be more friendly than cold.

    I have male orbiters up the asshole, none of which I’m attracted to. So many of them try so hard too, and they think they’re gaming me effectively. It doesn’t help that I come off as very sweet and nice- much nicer than I actually am. The boyfriend is alright, better than 99% of his competition. Meanwhile, the one alpha I’m in love with doesn’t like me at all because he’s probably rolling his eyes at all the beta attention I get.

    Life is tough as a 7.


    • YaReally
      on August 29, 2012 at 2:51 am
      Original Link

      I like how half this comment section is dedicated to trying to help a girl get laid.



Dr. Zoidberg
on August 28, 2012 at 6:31 pm
Original Link

I got completely fucked over by a redheaded 9.5 (so not only hot girl crazy, recessive gene red head crazy on top of it). I’ve seen that entire list happen and wasn’t wise enough to handle it. In retrospect, the greatest thing that could have happened to me. Every man should experience pure crazy. It will change your life.


  • YaReally
    on August 29, 2012 at 2:58 am
    Original Link

    I like a little crazy. Keeps things interesting.



Rum
on August 28, 2012 at 10:56 pm
Original Link

The strongest 10 – more like an 11 – that I ever got to know up close once told me that she had never masturbated and struggled to understand the concept.
Marilyn Monroe told her Pysch MD that she had never gone there. He claims to have taught her how to do so. Patient privacy issues were different back then.
Is there a story here? Is any self derived attention so lame in comparison to what is on tap from guys every second for actual 10s that there is no there there when they are alone?
More hands-on research needs to be done in this sensitive area of deep importance.


  • YaReally
    on August 29, 2012 at 3:04 am
    Original Link

    A Natural buddy of mine who laid over 100 new chicks last year and routinely has rotation girls and new girls he picks up on the weekend coming over through the week, doesn’t masturbate or have a porn collection or anything (well he has one but it’s some DVDs to put on when he has chicks over). He just doesn’t need to because he has such an abundance of women wanting to fuck him whenever he wants, and he actually looks at it as a failure, like the last possible resort and he’d have to be having a month long dry spell or something (pretty much impossible for him) before he’d resort to it.



Girl’s Night Out

Original Link

via Rational Male

YaReally
on August 29th, 2012 at 3:53 am
Original Link

Why would I be concerned about her going on a GNO? I’ve seen other guys’ game, it’s nothing to be worried about lol even outside of the bar on game blogs where guys are actively trying to learn how to seduce women, most of them couldn’t seduce their way out of a paper bag.

I’m more awesome than any guy she’s going to meet, it’s ridiculous to even consider worrying about it. Even if she did cheat, that would just mean she’s the dumbest girl in the world and would be doing me a favor lol

Now if I was other guys I’d be concerned, because their girls might run into ME. :)


YaReally
on August 29th, 2012 at 4:00 am
Original Link

I only do open relationships these days. Know how many girls who’ve been in open relationships with me (of various lengths of time from a few months to a few years), where they expressly have my PERMISSION to fuck other guys, go out and fuck other guys?

None. Not even on GNOs. They just want to fuck me. Why? Hypergamy.

Most hot girls aren’t looking to rack up a bunch of notches on the belt. They want to fuck the best of the best. They can get dick any time they turn around, they have 50 guys they could Facebook message saying “I’m horny” and a guy would show up at their door with his pants down. But they’ll ignore all those guys and chase you and wait for you if you’re higher value than all those other guys.

“but yareally, you’re not 6’5″ and rich with a 6-pack and Ferrari!!! Other guys have that!!!”

High-value is internal, not external. Welcome to game.


YaReally
on August 29th, 2012 at 4:13 am
Original Link

Also if you’re dating hot young socially outgoing girls, they’re going to want to go party with their friends. That’s what hot young socially outgoing girls do. You can snuff it out but they’ll end up resenting you for it and so will their peer groups and now you’re fighting a whole army of gossipy girls.

Now if your target market is old early 30s women with fading looks who have no friends or social life, or if you import a poor desperate girl from a 3rd world country and pay her to live with you, sure, ya, go ahead and tell her she’s not allowed to go lol


YaReally
on August 29th, 2012 at 2:08 pm
Original Link

Scarcity vs abundance.


Girl’s Night Out

Original Link

via Rational Male

YaReally
on August 30th, 2012 at 12:18 am
Original Link

“Don’t tell me you are so confident, you are such a star, that girls night out does not bother you. I know it bothers you, so she knows it bothers you, so if you let her do it, you look weak.”

You’re projecting your insecurities on us to make yourself feel better and protect your ego from admitting that you don’t really think highly of yourself. It’s like saying “well everyone steals” to avoid having to admit that you’re just a thief and a bad person.

“i see a lot of comments here from men that are in a lot of pain.”

Yup. I’ve noticed this is way more common in the Manosphere than the PUA community. I’d guess it has to do with PUA tending to attract younger guys without much experience with girls and the Manosphere tending to be discovered by older guys who’ve been thoroughly burned by women through divorces or massively failed LTRs, often more than once, and the angry MRA/MGTOW communities so there’s a lot more pain and bitterness here.

It’s sad because it’s only going to hold those guys back, ultimately.

Like seriously:

“So, forbid girls night out, and beat her if she does it anyway.”

Guys like this sound like extremely healthy well-adjusted socially adept alpha males who totally pick up and date hot girls regularly, instead of socially awkward angry men living bitter lonely Keyboard Jockey lives. Lol


YaReally
on August 30th, 2012 at 2:49 am
Original Link

“If she is not interested in sex with other guys, she is not interested in a girls night out.”

Lol have you ever even been around a girl before? Or, you know, around other human beings in general?


Girl’s Night Out

Original Link

via Rational Male

YaReally
on August 31st, 2012 at 2:32 am
Original Link

Hypergamy is about her wanting to fuck the highest value man. If you’re paranoid about her cheating on you, then you’re not the highest value man, and she can tell. It’s that simple.

The only woman that’s impossible to seduce is a woman who legitimately believes (whether it’s objectively true or not) that her man is higher-value than every other man.

I understand those of you who don’t actually pick up girls won’t be able to wrap your head around that so this is more for the benefit of the lurkers reading so they don’t get caught up in all the scarcity mindsets and insecure paranoia the low-value guys here are spouting. Yes, those guys SHOULD be paranoid and keep their girl on lockdown because their girls WILL cheat on them because if I can tell they’re low-value over the Internet, sure as shit their girls can too, and will happily jump ships if someone puts a high-value male in front of them…a GNO really IS a threat to them lol


Women Gossip To Compete For Men

Original Link

via Heartiste

YaReally
on August 25, 2012 at 5:46 pm
Original Link

“why, if gossip is, presumably, evolutionarily adaptive as a means of reducing the mate value of sexual competitors, men don’t do the same thing?”

PUAs stole some of this tactic from women for one of our AMOG tactics. We do it really subtle so it’s not as blatantly jealous/catty/gay as when girls do it. If a guy is talking to a girl I’m into and it looks like it’s going well, I’ll go to her friends and laugh as I drop a “wow who’s that creepy guy Sarah’s talking to?” comment to her friend. “oh, what? She LIKES him? lol oh my mistake then, never mind. I just saw him talking to some other girls earlier so I figured he was one of those creepy pickup guys. (totally sincere voice tone) It’s cool, I’m sure he’s really a nice dude, forget I said anything.”

Then I sip my drink with this face on:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/78/Trollface.svg/200px-Trollface.svg.png

…and let the girls start gossiping about the guy and looking at everything he does through the lens I gave them (while I 180 and completely defend the guy because I know that will just make them more adamant about how creepy he is till its to the point where I’M the one going “no he’s a nice guy he just likes her” and THEY’RE the ones going “no you don’t understand, this guy is up to something!!” lol) and inevitably they cockblock him, leaving me free to game her (plus now I have a bond with her friends, AND I wasn’t talking shit about the guy so I’m in the clear on all fronts “ya I don’t know why your friends scared that guy off, he seemed cool we did a shot earlier. Well maybe he has a GF or something and didn’t want to fight with your friends, who knows, hey it’s last call let’s all go get some food”).

He has no idea what happened and I don’t get my face punched in lol and I pick up where he left off and transfer her buying temperature from him to me:

http://www.seductionbase.com/seduction/cat/advanced/271.html

This was one of my main AMOG tactics because I don’t like getting into fights and, really, this is pretty funny to watch in action. It’s very consistent and follows pretty much the same pattern each time. Dance for me, puppets! lol



YaReally
on August 26, 2012 at 11:10 am
Original Link

oh comment moderation, we meet again. Tune in next week maybe for my contribution to this topic lol it tells you how to use gossip to get rid of AMOGs.


  • The Shocker
    on August 26, 2012 at 4:36 pm
    Original Link

    Funny you say that, I just successfully turned a sister off a guy I don’t like via pressing gossip buttons.

    I had three points:
    - Why does he live alone? Even his friends can’t stand him.
    - Classic sociopath, manipulative
    - Clown, inferiority complex

    The first one was what did it. Two hours after we spoke, she said on her own “I’m glad you said that, I shouldn’t be going out with someone who has a bad reputation especially since I just moved here.”

    Knowledge is power.


    • YaReally
      on August 29, 2012 at 1:48 am
      Original Link

      Plant the seed and they’ll water it for you.

      If you harp on what a loser he is, she’ll get mad at you and it’d push her even closer to him (no one wants to admit they made a bad investment). But let her come to the conclusion that he’s a loser herself (via your planting the seeds) and she’ll ditch him and make like it was her decision.

      Fascinating stuff all around. You can use this technique for some pretty twisted shit, if one were so inclined.



Hot Girls Need Your Best Game

Original Link

via Heartiste

YaReally
on August 23, 2012 at 6:08 pm
Original Link

ya a lot of PUAs learn how to land the 10s and then date a few and are like “fuck this is a hassle” and end up happily settling with a 7-8 because it’s way less work. Even when the chick herself is cool, you have to deal with an onslaught of male attention. It takes a shit-ton of security and abundance mentality to handle that stuff and most guys aren’t up to it.

Cue the fat feminist uggo lecturing us “that GAME stuff with your NEGS won’t work on MEEEEE”. No shit, it’s for hot girls who live in a reality you can’t even comprehend, the way a beta can’t comprehend the reality an alpha lives in lol


  • furiousferret
    on August 23, 2012 at 6:32 pm
    Original Link

    So if you are going out with your 10, what kind of hassles do you deal with? I’m not even talking about a nightclub, just out and about normal style.


    • YaReally
      on August 23, 2012 at 8:09 pm
      Original Link

      - the constant angry glares coming your way from guys wherever you go because they’re thinking “why is she with HIM? That’s bullshit, she should be with a guy like me…”

      - your friends awkwardly hitting on her whenever you bring her out, because she’s social and friendly and they’ve never talked to a girl that hot before so they’re all constantly vying for her attention, bro code goes way out the window

      - every single male you guys encounter together blatantly trying to flirt with her (not necessarily WELL, but TRYING). From store clerks trying to hit on her while they bag your groceries to cops letting her get off from tickets to bouncers saying “She can come in, but you have to wait in line” etc. Guys giving her free shit left and right. Most of them are all trying to get in “under the radar” and get on her Facebook or whatever just to “be friends”, and as a social girl she’ll often take their offers of friendship because that’s why she’s a 10 with a million friends in the first place. But we all know every single one of those guys is hoping they can sneak her out to hang out with them and fuck her.

      - at bars you get huge drunk AMOG guys (groups of them, at times) physically intimidating you and hitting on her and groping her and shit to try to get her away from you, which is fine if you’re a huge dude who wants to get into fights multiple times a night, but if you’re a normal guy you have to learn to deal with these guys allllll night long. Even if you CAN kick their ass, this’ll happen multiple times in a night every single night you go out, so it’s a fool’s errand to go that route unless you want to eventually end up in jail or with serious injuries when after you beat up the first 9 guys the 10th finally lands a hit on you.

      - the irony is that she’ll WANT to go out to bars with you. She’ll want to go out with her girlfriends and dance and shit because she’s a 10 so she’s probably in the 20-25 age range and that’s what they do. She’s willfully oblivious to all of this stuff and convinces herself “they’re just being nice” so any jealousy you show will make you look insecure and help throw her into their arms.

      - a lot of guys will actually be super nice to you, but again it’s with an ulterior motive of figuring out their competition and sneaking in under the radar, and you can pick up on that vibe pretty quick (ie – that bartender wouldn’t be giving you those shots on the house if you weren’t with this chick, oh and look he poured her an extra one)

      - in bars especially but also in daytime, you’ll run into the rich guys who will literally tell the girl they want to fly her to Paris and they’ll pay for it and everything. Like retarded offers that sound made up, but these guys have the money to do that. That’s part of why the value competition of “who has the tightest 6-pack abs and who has the most money” is silly, you will NEVER EVER WIN THAT. Even if you’re better looking and richer than everyone in your city, you’ll go on vacation to LA with your girl and a celebrity will mack on her. This is also why the really hot girls don’t care about that stuff, they’re surrounded by it so they’re looking for a guy with internal value since most of those guys don’t have it since they base their worth externally. This is why you’ll see smokin hot girls with ugly scrubby loser guys and go “wtf is that shit???” Meanwhile now you’re that guy from my first point staring daggers at that scrubby guy, which is what he has to put up with alllll day every day when he’s with her

      - in bars guys will SHOWER her with free drinks, shots, etc. because to them if they get her shit-faced they might have a chance to feel her up and get in her pants or rape her

      - super hot girls are used to being able to get away with more drama because no one EVER calls them out on their bullshit, so they’ll test you way more frequently than other girls. They also tend to like drama more because it’s so rare for their world to be unpredictable and scary since everything is handed to them on a silver platter by the world being extremely cautious about daring to offend the princess. So they’ll try to start drama with you just in hopes that they’ll get to feel something other than “being perfect”

      - girls and female friends will constantly insult your girlfriend when she’s not around and behind your guys’ backs and call you shallow and imply that she’s a dumb bimbo etc. etc. just out of jealousy so you have negativity on that side too. God forbid if she’s much younger than you and then you get the pedophile jokes on top of it and the implications that you’re taking advantage of this poor naive innocent girl (doesn’t matter if she’s smart as fuck and has degrees and shit)

      - she’ll have male orbiters, hundreds of them, from all walks of life, and a ton of them will be better looking, richer, etc. than you but she’ll consider them all her “friends”. They’re alllllll friend-zoned, but they’ll alllllll still TRY to get in her pants. So she’ll go out on what anyone else would call a “date” with them, but she’ll say they’re just “hanging out”, because hell, she gets a free steak dinner and to drive around in a lambourghini, why wouldn’t she want to go “hang out”? You would too if a girl was offering you that shit. She won’t fuck them, but the pangs of jealousy will eat away at your soul every minute she’s not around you. You could cut her off from all her male friends but then you’ll look insecure and controlling and they’ll all make sure to let her know that about you and try to poison her against you so that she’ll break up with you and they can fuck her

      - you have way less bargaining posture over her than you do with an average girl because an average girl has maybe a handful of orbiters and they’re all kind of lame compared to you so you have “hand” in the relationship since you can walk and get another girl. But with this girl, you probably can’t get another one as hot as her very easily since they’re rare to begin with especially if you live in a small town, and she has hundreds of amazing guys all lined up if she wants to pull “hand” and you both know this. As long as you have a solid frame and she sees you as higher value than all those guys, you’re fine, but she’s finely tuned to sniffing out low value in men so if you drop the ball at all, she can move on and not give a single fuck

      - on top of it, when you’re NOT around her, you don’t know what she’s up to except that every guy around her is hitting on her constantly and trying to fuck her. So she goes on a “girls night out” with her ladies, where you know they’ll be dressed up hot and get all the attention of the room and she’ll be drinking at a nightclub while you’re sitting at home paranoid that she’s going to get fucked by some other guy…and then she legit falls asleep or something when she gets home and forgets to txt you and your last txt from her was at midnight and said “baby im soooo drnk lol!!” and your mind fills in a million disaster scenarios till you hear from her the next afternoon at which point you worry because you have no idea if she was banging a guy all night and kicked him out or what and you know women lie about that shit…remember, all those guys at the bar are showering her with free drinks to try to fuck her

      - also, all of the guy’s hitting on her stuff still happens even if you’re claiming your space and have your arm around her, holding her hand, she’s holding onto your arm, etc., this will all still happen…especially when guys are drinking. Guys will have entire conversations just with her as if you don’t exist at all, so you have to either barge your way into the conversation and risk looking insecure or ignore her and walk off and hope that she doesn’t run off with that guy

      - god forbid if you end up in something really long-term with her and get married and then all of this is compounded by the fact that if she divorces you she gets half your money, kids, etc.

      so ya, there’s a lot of bullshit to deal with. Average girls don’t even understand that hot girls have this sort of lifestyle because they get way less attention and perks. And guys who haven’t dated 10s don’t understand what this is like, they just think “naw I’d keep her at home and she’d just be super hot and I’d be in heaven”.

      It’s possible to handle these girls, but you have to have absolutely no insecurity (which is where jealousy stems from) and KNOW, 100%, that you are the highest value male she can get…even if that’s not true objectively or based on external things like looks, money, etc. This is very difficult for most guys to do, so most guys who get 10s will fuck it up within a few months because they can’t keep up with the barrage of tests that’ll come their way from her and the rest of the world and as soon as you cave once she knows there’s chinks in your armor and you’re not as high value as you pretended to be.

      This is why ultimately game is to help you learn to BE high value, after you fake it for a while. You eventually become it and it’s internalized and you’re no longer faking it, and that’s where you can handle dating a legit 10.

      (side note, a girl who’s super hot isn’t necessarily a 10…girls who are super hot but still insecure or low self-esteem (usually these are the super bratty bitchy girls in clubs) aren’t 10s because they only have the looks not the personality. A legit 10 will be smokin hot and cool as fuck and friendly to everyone around her, which is part of what causes all the trouble I listed lol every guy thinks he’s getting Approach Invites and iois lol)


      • realmatt
        on August 23, 2012 at 8:54 pm
        Original Link

        Honestly, you wreak of insecurity.

        If a girl you’re “dating” is going on dated with other guys in expensive cars and shit then she isn’t that into you.

        And if she tells you one of her faggot male friends is taking her out and she doesn’t immediately blow him off when you tell her you’re going some where and she’s going with you, then she is not that into you and you should cut your losses before you’re officially chumpified.


        • YaReally
          on August 29, 2012 at 10:50 am
          Original Link

          Sorry, I don’t speak Keyboard Jockey. Come back after you’ve left your computer room a few times.


      • furiousferret
        on August 23, 2012 at 9:57 pm
        Original Link

        Also,

        ‘A legit 10 will be smokin hot and cool as fuck and friendly to everyone around her, which is part of what causes all the trouble I listed lol every guy thinks he’s getting Approach Invites and iois lol)’

        This one area where I completely understand bitch shields from attractive women. Without the shield up all the lesser betas/omegas crawl out of the woodwork and she now has a bonafide stalker.

        I have seen this happen to attractive women with bubbly personalities. They are super friendly and giving out false IOIs and all the sudden the creepy overweight lesser beta now has found a pussy oasis in the blueballan desert.

        That’s why I never critcize super hot women from putting up bitch shields.


        • YaReally
          on August 23, 2012 at 11:25 pm
          Original Link

          ya, it’s survival for them. Once you understand that you stop looking at shit-tests as bitchy behavior that pisses you off and you see it for what it is: her method of weeding out guys who aren’t as awesome as you are. :)

          The whole strip-club industry is based off guys not being able to read real from fake iois and coming back because Sapphire loves them, no you guys don’t understand, we have a connection, blah blah. Meanwhile as soon as he’s gone she’s laughing to her friends about her regular “whale” (aka sucker who she can get tons of money out of by leading him on).

          If you go to Vegas the hookers try to blend in with the rest of the crowd and make up fake stories and shit to explain why they’re there and it’s all pretty believable but if you can tell the different between real and fake iois you can figure out which chicks are working girls and which are legit pretty fast. Same principle applies to really hot girls who are just being friendly or using you to make someone else jealous or using you for attention VS actually INTO you.

          This all comes from field experience.


      • immoralgables
        on August 23, 2012 at 10:01 pm
        Original Link

        @YaReally

        Where did you start out when you first started learning game in terms of the girls you were taking down.

        Did you start with the 5s and get the experience/confidence and work your way up or did you just say fuck it and aim much higher and do the fake it until you make it gambit?

        Just curious because I see the merits of both strategies and would like to hear your perspective and how you went about it once you started learning.


        • YaReally
          on August 23, 2012 at 11:31 pm
          Original Link

          oh no I fucked some super uggos when I started lol I was a hard case newbie though, I was starting off from a way worse position than most guys. I had never even had female friends in my life, let alone dates or anything like that, and I was in my early 20s. So at the start ANYTHING was amazing success to me.

          Now I just honestly can’t get a boner for girls who aren’t a certain level or type of hotness. I have pretty specific tastes both in looks/style and personality type. I like the bitchy loud girls lol, ’cause they’re a challenge and most guys can’t handle those types.

          Ironically before I got into game all I wanted was a quiet submissive little asian chick I could be all romantic and cuddle with. But that was because I hadn’t been with any chicks and didn’t know what actually gets me hard or keeps me interested in a relationship.


          • YaReally
            on August 24, 2012 at 5:11 am
            Original Link

            “Ya seems to me that the fact that you started at zero was very beneficial for your trajectory in pick-up.”

            Ya, I wouldn’t have believed it at the time, but it all worked out in my favor. I was able to absorb PUA concepts quickly because I didn’t have a lot of “no way, that’s not how it works!!!” or “but I don’t want it to BE like that!!!” notions getting in the way. My thinking was more “Oh, what? THAT’S how it works? Okay, these guys clearly know more than I do so I’ll go try this shit out then!”

            Ultimately I had other areas to catch up on (learning to connect with women and see them as more than just for sex, though I’ve got that down now) and I am pretty fucked up when it comes to actual long-term relationships, the concept of being with one person for years and years is completely foreign to me because I never dated before. So those are things I have to work on that most people who went through the normal dating process already have some experience, good or bad, with.

            Is it a better trade-off? Hard to say, depends on your goals I guess. I know that if I want to ever settle down and have the white-pickett fence and 2.5 kids and all that, I’m going to have a shit-load of challenges ahead of me compared to a lot of people (like how to stay interested in a girl for more than a few months). But for this period in my life where I like just getting laid and having multiple on-going relationships with the occasional dabble into something more serious, this works out nice for me. :)

            (there IS PUA literature on managing long-term relationships and living with a woman and raising kids with her and stuff and I’ve read a lot of it but I don’t have much interest in actually applying it right now)


      • Anonymous
        on August 23, 2012 at 10:33 pm
        Original Link

        You talk a pretty big game, champ, and I find much of your commentary quite insightful. However, this comment leaves me scratching my head about your actual, as opposed to theoretical, prowess. Throughout this detailed post about the pitfalls of dating a 10, you seem to accept a shit ton of bad behavior from these “10s” that I NEVER tolerate from ANY female under my dominion, and yes, I date 8s, 9s, and 10s.

        Why don’t you just lay down the laws of what it means to be your bitch, and kick her to the curb if she doesn’t comply? None of your complex observations about 10s ever enter my world (they used to, years ago), because they know it’s forbidden. They either willingly abide by my rules, which I lay down upfront, or they go elsewhere, voluntarily or otherwise.

        I find that more than any other principle, the one thing that the really hot bitches all desire is RULES THAT WILL BE ENFORCED WITHOUT PASSION OR PREJUDICE. All the world bends its rules for them, and this creates an ever shifting reality (like the Matrix flicks) for which the female mind is ill equipped. What they really desire is to know that they have secured a FIXED place in the clan, and this social definition is delineated by rules that are enforced, with no consideration given to their beauty.


        • joemomma35
          on August 23, 2012 at 11:37 pm
          Original Link

          I see how his elongated post gives you this impression. I could write this up myself given the time and the passion. I still consider my game well above average but far from perfect. I know within a few years I’ll be solid as hell…and when it gets to that point I would not write something like this. But it’s not like these points aren’t true…everyone starts somewhere.

          Though your point goes back to what I said, and what is commonly said on this blog, is that you must have the self confidence as a man to dump even the hottest chicks on their ass when you can and move on to another girl. Really I don’t think this can be faked, you have to have the game and self confidence to go out there and be able to pick up some hot girls without too much effort. It takes time to get to that point.


          • YaReally
            on August 23, 2012 at 11:57 pm
            Original Link

            “I know within a few years I’ll be solid as hell…and when it gets to that point I would not write something like this. But it’s not like these points aren’t true…everyone starts somewhere.”

            Oh, I get it now. My bad, I didn’t realize I was giving the impression that I put up with all of that stuff or don’t have my own ways of dealing with it or training it out of girls.

            No, my post was describing what that intermediate guy who gets his first 10 is going to run into and get gobsmacked by because he completely wasn’t expecting any of it. All of that shit is laughable to me now, but when you date your first 10 you run into it and are like “wait I thought this was supposed to be awesome?? fuuuuuuck :( :(

            I’ve seen a LOT of guys lose a lot of hot girls over the years because they couldn’t get rid of their insecure jealousy and they ultimately sabotaged themselves.

            I’m actually partly built without a “jealousy switch” because of how I started out. I never went through the romantic phase of life with puppy-love and all that, I went right from no interactions with women to seeing them from a PUA perspective. So for me women are completely sexual creatures and I view their actions from a pretty cold perspective…if a girl ditches me for another guy I don’t think “what a bitch grrr :( :( ” I just think “oh, cool, ya he was doing such and such so of course she’d go to him.” No emotional reaction really…that’s part of what really hot social girls like about me.


        • YaReally
          on August 23, 2012 at 11:51 pm
          Original Link

          oh, cool, are we comparing e-Penises, “champ”? lol

          I let them get away with that behavior because it doesn’t bother me.

          Like she can take a dozen guys’ numbers right in front of me if she wants, it doesn’t matter, none of those guys have enough game to fuck her and if they did they wouldn’t be able to fuck her the way I fuck her. I know that, and she knows that, so it doesn’t matter to me if she “disrespects” me that way.

          She can act like a bitch to me or throw a temper tantrum if she wants, I don’t care any more than I’d care if my 5 year old niece called me a poopy-head or didn’t want to eat her vegetables. I’m not going to be like “fuck you, 5 year old niece! I don’t tolerate that shit, I’m an alpha badass!! NEXT!!!!” That’s just what girls do and it’s silly and doesn’t affect me in any way.

          If she does something that crosses one of my personal lines, I don’t even bother to bitch her out about it. I just call up a different girl instead of her next time. Wtf do I care?

          The irony is that the fact that I’m so apathetic about it is what makes them tend not to test me with it. They’ll test at the start to see how I handle it and when they realize I legit don’t give a shit because I can get other girls, they shape up and choose not to do a lot of that stuff because they’re scared I’ll leave them.

          A girl you take out accepts a drink from a random guy at the bar and starts flirting with him. In your world, you go “NEXT!!! Fuck you bitch! That’s against my rules!!” and flip her off. In mine I shrug and start talking to a table of girls nearby and trust that my girl will come back to me. If she doesn’t, I fuck one of the girls at the table, who cares?

          The fear of loss can be a lot more powerful than the fear of authority. Especially with really hot chicks who know that meeting a man who can handle them is rare. Remember we’re talking 10s here, not 8s and 9s.

          Your way sets rules and all and works and you can definitely just bang them on the side that way, but you’re throwing away a lot of trainable girls unneccesarily. Plus you’ll have a harder time dating a popular young 10 long-term because you’ll have more trouble getting along with her social circles. A 10 isn’t a recluse sitting inside playing Warcraft with no real life friends, a 10 is a chick that has an entire world she’s used to that’s all vying for her attention 24/7. When she posts a pic up on Facebook it gets 100 Likes in 10 minutes. Her phone is going off all day with people wanting to hang out with her. She has hundreds of orbiters buzzing around her constantly and a lot of those orbiters are people she can’t just cut out from her life because they do things for her that she needs done.

          It’s like an open relationship, most guys are like “OMG you can’t be in an open relationship, she’s going to fuck all these other guys you’re such a pussy to let that happen!” But that’s because they don’t understand that her hypergamy makes her only want to fuck me, because all those other guys are lame compared to me. The very fact that I tell her “go ahead and fuck other guys if you want (shrug)” is what makes her see me as high enough value that I don’t even care if she fucks other guys…she ends up choosing to be faithful to me because she hopes to finally win me over from my open lifestyle one day.

          We’re talking about really advanced shit here though. I’m sure your e-Penis is much bigger than mine.


        • Anon
          on August 24, 2012 at 4:15 am
          Original Link

          Yep,
          Rule n°1: No flirting with other guys.
          Rule n°2: If she goes out with her girlfriends, she must be home by 10.

          Call me an insecure chump, but I prefer that to being a cuckold. And I dated girls in many categories. Although I don’t really go for the very social types.
          I prefer shy girls. They can be pretty damn hot, and they’re way easier to deal with.


          • YaReally
            on August 24, 2012 at 5:12 am
            Original Link

            That’s cool man, whatever floats your boat. We’re talking about a different type of girl here, is all.


          • YaReally
            on August 29, 2012 at 10:54 am
            Original Link

            “It’s obvious that a social butterfly 10 with a flirty vibe will make your life miserable.”

            This is absolutely true, if you aren’t a social butterfly 10 with a flirty vibe yourself. aka – someone who can handle and enjoys these kinds of girls instead of wanting to jump out of the shadows, interact with as few people as infrequently as possible, throw a sack over a 10 and bring her back to your shadowy lair where you can imprison her and make sure she never speaks to another soul but yourself again because you hate interacting with the world and being in social environments.

            Not meaning you, specifically, but this is the mentality of a lot of guys in the manosphere and pickup communities. :) “I want that super hot 10 that all the other guys want…but I want to still be an anti-social creeper. How do I make this happen?”


      • lightlybraisedturnipdotcom
        on August 24, 2012 at 4:44 am
        Original Link

        Ya really, I agree with most of your post except for one thng. It is not enough to internalize high status and game to get a 10. Life should be that simple. You need some status, some looks, some money or a good deal of one or two of the above. We cannot rely on only Jedi mind tricks. Women need a threshhold level of desireability.

        This means we can’t take shortcuts. And we can aspire just to date or marry to our highest ability.


        • Anon
          on August 24, 2012 at 4:53 am
          Original Link

          Yareally focuses on attraction. And he’s absolutely right that money, status and looks don’t count… as long as you’re not unbearably ugly or deformed.

          But you’re right about relationships. You can’t have a successful long-term relationship with a 10 if you’re not successful, or at least ambitious and “on a mission” like in the 16 commandments of poon.

          But still, you can be a rich master of the universe alpha, with a strong frame and game. Your wife can be totally madly in love and some guy like yareally can still fuck her while she is shopping, solely because of attraction.

          On the other hand, a loser alpha like Yareally likes to portray himself has higher odds of losing the girl early because she will want security and money or whatever. She could leave him, find a rich beta boyfriend/husband, and still fuck yareally on the side. Again, because of attraction.


          • YaReally
            on August 24, 2012 at 5:35 am
            Original Link

            “or at least ambitious and “on a mission” like in the 16 commandments of poon.”

            This. A girl cares more about your potential than what you have. You can have money, a 6-pack, confidence, and an amazing 6 figure career, but I’ll pit my “walking into a restaraunt where all the staff know me by name and the waitresses flirt with me and the manager comes out to shake my hand and my smokin’ hot ex drops a jealous comment on her way past our table while I tell the girl I’m with all about my ambitious hopes and dreams for the future” against your external shit any day. :)

            “But still, you can be a rich master of the universe alpha, with a strong frame and game.”

            The problem is to get the 6-pack and earn the 6-figures, often guys will be working 80+ hour weeks and spending 2 hours a day in the gym. Then they’re driving around in their expensive BMW to get places.

            Meanwhile I have no job or do minimal work and I work out once a week, so I have tons of free time, and I have a roommate who parties so I meet people through him, and I ride the public bus or subway so I’m pretty much surrounded by women and people in general to chat up all day long. And when a girl is horny I have a flexible schedule so I’m available at a moment’s notice while the master of the universe has to find time to schedule her in. I can sit around all day txting dirty shit to all the girls on my phone, I’m not a CEO making important calls to Japan.

            Which of us is going to have sharper seduction skills?

            One of my Natural buddies with no job literally calls up a fuckbuddy, then comes out to the bar to pick up a new one, then bangs that new one and sends her home and comes back to the bar to get another one for last call lol He’s done it a few times. Dude’s sex drive is thru the roof though, legit sex addict. Fascinating to see though. For a while he was working two jobs, he had tons of money but no free time to get laid. He actually quit one of his jobs so he could get pussy again lol

            “She could leave him, find a rich beta boyfriend/husband, and still fuck yareally on the side.”

            This is basically what happens. I lose fuckbuddies all the time, I call it “boyfriending up”. There’s actually a pattern to when/why/how it happens so I’m usually expecting it. Suddenly I won’t hear from a girl anymore or she’ll start txting less in general or she’ll send a big dramatic “I can’t see you anymore, I’ve met someone…” speech txt lol or she’ll put up LMR when I try to fuck her and then get all dramatic on me. I don’t care at all, I can get other girls and if I want to pursue those particular girls for whatever reason, I can…the way I set the frame up, I’m not a provider at all, so the only reason she’s looking for another guy to be her “boyfriend” is that she wants someone who’ll give her provider shit. To get her all I have to do is start showing provider potential to her.

            But I’m actually in favor of them finding guys they can settle down with. If that’s what she’s looking for, and some other guy will provide it, cool, best of luck to them both, there are other girls for me. I don’t need to hog the ones that want more than I’m offering, I back off completely and let the other guy have them.

            But inevitably they either come back (since I’m a good fuck and the other guy usually has no game and she gets bored) or they keep my number “just in case…” and I get a txt when they’re drunk/horny etc. God forbid I run into them out at a bar or something, if their guy isn’t there it’s pretty much a done deal that we’ll fuck. Hell, even if their guy IS there, I can flirt with her subtly behind his back or right in front of him because the connection is already there from before. My above-mentioned Natural buddy does the same thing all the time.

            “I have a boyfriend now!”
            “lol of course you do…(proceed as normal, to sex)”

            She won’t break up with him, but I’ll be the guy on the side that she’s using his money to buy sexy lingerie for.


    • lightlybraisedturnipdotcom
      on August 23, 2012 at 11:42 pm
      Original Link

      I dated one “10″ in my life. One or two 9′s maybe, but only one 10. She was a working model for the best (or one of them) agency.

      Everywhere you went people would gravitate to her. It was a spectacle. Servers would get nervous. People were honored to be near her.

      She created drama you could write a book about. I had a sense of what “game” was at the time, but eventually I got too close to the sun and her tests too twisted.


      • Jason
        on August 24, 2012 at 1:24 am
        Original Link

        THIS. And YaReally’s post too.

        I dated an Elite model for about two months. She was 31, but her hair, face, and figure were 21. She was a 10, thru and thru.

        I landed her with a cocky bet about how long it would be before she would let me fuck her. (My guess: Two weeks. Reality: Two hours.)

        Still, I couldn’t hold onto her because of the shit tests. Like H says, it really wasn’t worth it. She was mediocre in the sack, and the number of men who hit on her WHILE SHE WAS ON MY ARM was maddening.

        Moral: An 8 is the sweet spot, especially one who grew up in a cave and doesn’t know that she’s an 8.

        Well said, YaReally.


        • lightlybraisedturnipdotcom
          on August 24, 2012 at 4:14 am
          Original Link

          Agree it generally is not worth it. It is not her fault, but with the whole world after her she is going to go crazy and test everyone’s limits. And these limits will stretch to grotesque proportions. Theft, betrayal, capital crimes.

          8′s that are smart and fun to be around are better prospects for virtually anyone. Given the freedom women have here to do whatever makes them feel good, 10s are powder kegs. Imagine having kids with one and just waiting for the day for her to tell you she is bored and needs to move on because she is not fulfilled and needs someone different.


          • YaReally
            on August 24, 2012 at 5:40 am
            Original Link

            “It is not her fault”

            That’s the main thing to remember. In a way I actually feel bad for some of them. Imagine if you couldn’t go ANYWHERE without fat gross toothless women hitting on you CONSTANTLY. Ya, getting some free shit would be cool here and there at first, but for the most part not only would you have to develop ways to get them to fuck off, but you’d also be frustrated because with them surrounding you all the time the super hot chick across the room who you WANT to fuck and who WANTS to fuck you, won’t come over and say hi.

            It’s like celebrities who can’t escape the paparazzi and who will never experience having privacy again. It’s sad in a way.



joemomma35
on August 23, 2012 at 6:30 pm
Original Link

Yep, hot chicks require the best game, shit test the hardest, have the highest sense of entitlement…it’s all been said a million times on this blog. They are also by in large the most socially savvy because of all the dudes who have thrown their game at her in the past. The reward is sweet for gaming these girls but it can be a pain in the ass, especially if she’s an attention whore (and a whore in general) and you know all the other guys in the room would gladly fuck the girl you’re with – and are more likely to think that they have a shot because of her flirty nature.

All of this said, every guy who is out there needs the experience. Hot chicks will keep your game the tightest by their very nature and will make lesser women that much easier to bang. When I started getting hotter chicks I realized much more about the game – such as the fact that guys (and girls – but girls don’t interlope unless she’s a cock block) know when your game is tight with the girl you’re with because of the vibe you have with her – and they react to this instinctively and almost always will look elsewhere.


  • YaReally
    on August 23, 2012 at 8:41 pm
    Original Link

    “every guy who is out there needs the experience. Hot chicks will keep your game the tightest by their very nature and will make lesser women that much easier to bang.”

    Agreed. I like these girls for that reason (plus they’re hot lol). The challenge toughens you up and hones your game. Part of why I have no problems handling AMOGs and taking girls off most of the rich good-looking club guys is because I’ve been with girls where I had to do that constantly. The guys who are like “I’d punch a guy if he hit on my girl in front of me” are guys who haven’t been with a 10 because they don’t understand just how many guys they’d have to be punching (it’d be like that old Kung Fu arcade game) and all the social dynamics involved in being around a 10s social circle. She would ditch you if you went around taking swings at her social circle of “friends” who are “just being nice” (since she convinces herself they don’t want to fuck her and are just being nice since she doesn’t actually WANT to fuck them but she wants to be able to accept all the free shit and attention guilt-free). Mystery Method is actually solid studying for dating a 10 (no surprise, that was the purpose of it) because it’s very non-aggressive and shows you how to handle a lot of the problems I mentioned in a friendly and social but higher value than everyone else way. It’s very subtle and a 10 needs a guy like that to handle her “world”.

    “know when your game is tight with the girl you’re with because of the vibe you have with her – and they react to this instinctively and almost always will look elsewhere.”

    Yep. One way to see how high value a guy is is to look at how other people in the room are reacting to him, especially the hot girls.

    Ultimately if you’re extremely confident and high value and a guy hits on your girl, she’ll be friendly to him and even take #s and stuff just to not be rude, but she’ll be clinging to your arm or looking around for you and the guy will get a wall in front of him where if he’s not a socially inept aspie, he’ll realize he has no shot because she’s too into you. He might still TRY because she’s hot enough to be worth trying against impossible odds, but he’ll get the “keep you at arms length” politeness that a hot celebrity would give you if you ran into them at a bar. Like “hey I’ll be nice but seriously this isn’t gonna happen sorry :)


    • Anonymous
      on August 23, 2012 at 10:57 pm
      Original Link

      Okay, you evidently have your own method for training them to abide by your rules. It seems to me from this comment that you achieve that through indirect means. I can respect that. In the interest of complete explanation for the other readers, I just do it directly, by explaining to them the rules required for being in my life.

      I submit to the readership that this approach works for 10s, as well as it would work for 6s and 7s. I suppose it comes back to the whole direct vs. indirect spectrum. I go direct on every facet of human relationships — just works more efficiently for me… but for that worldview to work, you’ve got to be willing to walk away, at any given moment. There are six billion humans on the planet, and half of them are bitches. That’s a lot of bitches.


      • YaReally
        on August 24, 2012 at 12:04 am
        Original Link

        “It seems to me from this comment that you achieve that through indirect means. I can respect that.”

        ya, sorry for the e-Peen jokes, I didn’t realize my intial post wasn’t clear.

        I always prefer the indirect way because I have really wide boundaries. My rules are way more tolerant than most guys because I just don’t care. I have other girls, I can get other girls, and I have other shit to do with my time so if a girl “disrespects” me it’s like shrug, okay, now you don’t get to hang out with me until you smarten up. It’s her loss, not mine.

        “I just do it directly, by explaining to them the rules required for being in my life.”

        Ya, this works, I don’t disagree, I’m just really chill and laid back as a person. If you cause a scene at my party I won’t bitch you out and lecture you, I’m not your dad, you just won’t get an invite to my next party, ya know?

        Some guys get off on lecturing a chick and being like “hah, I showed HER!!!” I just can’t work up the energy to give enough of a shit to do that lol

        Some guys will run into a dude who talks smack to them and punch them out. Some guys will just shrug and walk away to hang out with someone else. Both ways end the interaction. I like the indirect route because it causes less negative vibes around me, I don’t like drama in my life.


        • Anonymous
          on August 24, 2012 at 10:58 am
          Original Link

          “I always prefer the indirect way because I have really wide boundaries. My rules are way more tolerant than most guys because I just don’t care.”

          Assuming that you really developed yourself from zero to hero, I respect you… but you’re not perfect. We’re all works in progress.

          I say this not to attack you, but for the men who look to your commentary. Having “really wide boundaries” and just not caring, is diametrically opposed to the reality of visceral manhood. It may be a good strategy when dealing with poon, but it is most definitely NOT a good strategy when dealing with life, and it is most definitely NOT a strategy that is good for the men in the trenches at your shoulder. THE defining characteristic of manhood is CARING. Women have babies sucked out of their uterus by vacuum tubes, precisely because they DON’T care. And they know this. A man who CARES is precisely the quality of masculine energy that a 10 wants to devote her life to (as opposed to dalliance), because they desire CARING, caring about one’s clan, about something worthy of their 10 status, something that is not inherent to their feminine being. The yin to the yang, and all that. This, above all else, is what the 10s seek. And, in the face of potential rejection, it takes considerable courage to express that, especially to a 10.

          So, to the readers, listen to YaReally. He spits a great deal of truth, but know that he’s on his own individual path. Don’t follow him over the edge, into oblivion.


          • YaReally
            on August 24, 2012 at 9:06 pm
            Original Link

            lol I’ll be a student of game till I die. I’m not perfect, I just have a lot more PUA-specific experience than most of the manosphere.

            To clarify tho: I do care about things, but they’re things that are actually important to me. I’m cut-throat when it comes to male friendships, do me wrong and you can go fuck yourself. Because from guys I expect a certain level of behavior and no bullshit. And from a girl I make my actual serious girlfriend, I’ll end that shit on a dime if she crosses certain rules I have.

            But having a young clubbing-aged 10 in my rotation of girls as a casual fuckbuddy, I just don’t see where it’s worth the stress to get all worked up over her doing silly “girl shit”. It’s like getting into bar fights at 2am because some guy disrespected you by looking at you funny…ya, you’re passionate, cool, but that’s what drunk idiots DO at 2am, is try to pick fights. I’m 30, wtf do I care about that nonsense? lol

            You can tell yourself you Next all the girls who don’t follow your rules but make no mistake, they’re Nexting YOU by not giving a shit about your rules in the first place.



Days of Broken Arrows
on August 23, 2012 at 7:44 pm
Original Link

I was window shopping and came across an OKCupid profile where a woman said, at the end, something like “And don’t try that Neil Strauss shit on me. It won’t work.”

She’s in the 8-9 category, so I thought this might merit an email to you. What do you do when a woman is onto game. I’ll send you info if you’re interested.


  • YaReally
    on August 23, 2012 at 8:44 pm
    Original Link

    lol E-Mail her “hey, I can only stay for a minute and then I have to get back to my friends, but I need a female opinion: who do you think lies more, men or women?

    Did it work? Are you dying to jump my bones? Wait, let me try page 38, there’s a really good one about how I’m supposed to make fun of your hair…”


    • Days of Broken Arrows
      on August 23, 2012 at 8:48 pm
      Original Link

      That’s pretty damned clever I have to admit. And it just might work. I should mention this is someone I might not want to be in touch with because at one point she wrote “I am a feminist.”

      I didn’t notice that at first, as I was too busy reading the survey questions about her perverted sex life and checking out her pics.


      • YaReally
        on August 24, 2012 at 12:08 am
        Original Link

        Send it and let us know if she responds. I figure if she reads it she’ll have to respond because it’s purposely poking her buttons. I would just make fun of the whole thing if she responds and lead it into stuff like “well shit, I guess I’ll just have to try having a normal conversation with you and do that whole “get to know you and actually take an interest in you” thing…god, dating is so much work these days! I’m pretty sure the pickup book would tell me to just invite you to my sex dungeon, but how about we try a cup of coffee sometime instead lol”

        And then do her in the bum.



Rum
on August 23, 2012 at 11:31 pm
Original Link

I will not go so far as to say that 5 minutes with a 10 is better than 5 years with an 7-8. But I will state without hesitation that a couple of hours with a 10 is pretty dam fine even when you know how it will end.


  • YaReally
    on August 24, 2012 at 12:09 am
    Original Link

    Hell yes. lol



Hot Girls Need Your Best Game

Original Link

via Heartiste

a girl
on August 24, 2012 at 5:54 pm
Original Link

true – there’s a definite attention difference between a 7 or so and a 9 or 10.

I’m about a 7. (5 “3, 105, D cup, cute, glasses) My sister is a solid 9 or 10 (awesome body, stunning face).

Mostly I dress cute, but modestly & not to attract attention. Heads do turn in normal life when I’m not dressed up, and I do sometimes get approached out of the blue, but it’s not constant. That kind of attention is nice, but isn’t crazy.

With my sister the attention is constant. I can dress down for less attention & to blend in, but she would have to wear a disguise. The attention can be non-stop. Restaurants, walking down the street, the library, the grocery store. If we go out, and when I say go out, I mean like to lunch or the grocery store, we’ll either get stares or get approached. It’s nuts.

If you have a daughter who is a 9 or a 10 you have to teach her that the attention is superficial and bullshit. Get her involved in other activities away from boys. Or the attention will fuck her up.


  • YaReally
    on August 24, 2012 at 9:17 pm
    Original Link

    “The attention can be non-stop. Restaurants, walking down the street, the library, the grocery store. If we go out, and when I say go out, I mean like to lunch or the grocery store, we’ll either get stares or get approached. It’s nuts.”

    GRRRRR!!!! She better not be nice to any of those people or dare flirt or smile or anything, she better be shouting all day long at every single one of those people “fuck off, I’m with YaReally!!” or I’m gonna NEXT her!!!! GRRRRRR!!!!!

    lol like I say dating a legit 10 is something most guys can’t comprehend. In their head they’re going to lay down the law and they might have dated a pretty hot girl or a really hot but quiet/shy girl, but they’re extrapolating the world of an 8 or 9 and basing their theory on that. The world is literally a different world for a legit 10. If you Next them as fast as some of the guys here want to, it’s no wonder you haven’t experienced their world first hand.

    It’s worse than this lol:



a girl
on August 24, 2012 at 7:24 pm
Original Link

yeah – one last thing.

A lot of the people saying they’ve dated a 10 — I don’t think they have. The whole “I’d just punch him” or “I walk away” wouldn’t fly. Those two strategies would irritate or bore a solid 9 or a 10.

Solid 9 or 10s, it’s the looks, but it’s not just looks, it’s charisma or body language or something. She’s magnetic. Men can do this too. But people turn when they walk into rooms & their social skills are awesome. People want to be around them.


  • YaReally
    on August 24, 2012 at 9:28 pm
    Original Link

    Yes, thankyou, this is what I’m trying to get across lol

    There’s theory and then there’s real life. Hey my rule is a girl can’t ever blink. Oh shit Megan Fox just blinked. NEXT!! I just Nexted Megan Fox, guys, aren’t I a badass?

    Like okay, way to demonstrate how high you value yourself. But you’re not fucking her. She Nexted you by ignoring your macho rule-laying-down because she knows she can have her pick from a thousand other guys and she’s not going to turn down a lifetime of free vacations to Paris and modeling contracts and guys who can help her acting career if she adds them to her Facebook etc for your ass. :)

    I’m not kidding about these free trips and shit. I’ve been to high-end clubs where guys literally have private jets and offer girls shit like that. I know a fuckbuddy and her friend (both with boyfriends) who were flown to another country and put up in a 5 star hotel and given like a thousand bucks each to go shopping by a 50yo sugar daddy the friend WASN’T EVEN ACTUALLY FUCKING lol. My FB was nervous about it so the guy even promised he wouldn’t stay at their hotel with them and shit. He was just buying some time to flirt with the friend (he got a BJ from her out of it).

    And these girls weren’t even 10s.



The Allure Of Male Dominance

Original Link

via Heartiste

Adonis The Vengeful
on August 23, 2012 at 10:38 am
Original Link

Standing over my 20 yearold gf (9 years my junior) after aggressive sex, my hand on her throat, her lips pursed, my seed spilled inside her because fuck it, going raw sucks and nutting inside is what I want to do….feelsgoodman


  • reino341
    on August 23, 2012 at 1:02 pm
    Original Link

    did you mean *not* going raw sucks?

    watched this today after having some trouble coming with a condom yesterday:


    • Adonis The Vengeful
      on August 23, 2012 at 3:03 pm
      Original Link

      Yes NOT raw sucks


      • Maya
        on August 23, 2012 at 3:13 pm
        Original Link

        I would agree with that. I can’t imagine having sex with a condom. It’s so unromantic.


        • YaReally
          on August 23, 2012 at 11:05 pm
          Original Link

          Part of why I use a condom is because girls are retarded like this. All that stuff the main stream media tells everyone about how girls will want guys to use condom and it’s the man’s responsibility to make sure he has one on him and how guys are always the one’s that’ll be like “no baby let’s not use one…” and try to just stick it in etc is bullshit.

          The number of girls who’ve not just been okay with not using a condom but actively whined when I put one on is terrifying. If they want to go condomless with me, they’ve gone condomless with other guys. Don’t be a fool, wrap yer tool!



YaReally
on August 23, 2012 at 12:37 pm
Original Link

Submissive women want to be dominated because they love it. Dominant women want to be dominated because it’s so rare that they meet a man who CAN dominate them.

Dominant women are usually VERY shocked when you show them you understand this concept. I’ll even say it flat out to them.

I’ve found that a lot of dominant women who legitimately get off on sexually dominating men (not to be confused with feminist type women who’ve been brainwashed to pretend to like being in charge but are secretly (even to them) dying for a man to take the lead), tend to like being dominant to a man on the side but actually have a primary man who dominates them (ie – the submissive men are play-things for her that her dominant primary man allows her to have).

The sex when you’re dominating a dominant woman is usually pretty fucking awesome and depraved lol the loss of power is so rare to them that they go all out in the role of being submissive and want you to defile them to some pretty fucked up extremes.


  • Spiralina
    on August 23, 2012 at 12:43 pm
    Original Link

    Not to pry, but is this comment related to the pooping on a woman incident? :-)


    • YaReally
      on August 23, 2012 at 1:37 pm
      Original Link

      To an extent. She was dominant in her relationship but it was only because her man became beta over time so SOMEONE had to wear the pants. In the bedroom she’d try to dominate (slap me, hit me, scratch me, spit at me, etc) but it was more about trying to piss me off so I’d do worse things to her than about her getting actual sexual satisfaction from dominating. The more she’d try to dominate the more she’d get excited from the anticipation of what I’d do to her when I got ahold of her. Basically she loved the thrill of poking the sleeping bear and panicking over when and how it’s going to react.

      I’d let her get away with some of it and then suddenly just plow through it enraged and grab her…it wouldn’t have been as fun a fantasy for her if I didn’t play along and let her feel like she had control at first. It’s that “oh fuck the tables have turned on me” feeling that she got off on.

      Over time I just ran out of stuff to do to degrade her and had to reach into some pretty twisted corners lol we were doing stuff you only see in fucked up foreign Internet porn and I’d make her send me pics and vids of herself doing twisted shit to herself when I wasn’t around (so it wasn’t just about me doing stuff to her physically, it was about overall being dominated by me). The thing is that she didn’t love the things because of the acts themselves, she loved them because it was the bear waking up…so whether it was shitting on her or just slapping her around, the turn-on for her was that it was me reacting to her. The more fucked up the stuff I did to her was, the more of a reaction she was getting from me, the more of a turn-on it was for her.

      The “I’m going to treat you like shit because I WANT to piss you off and have you overpower me and punish me for it” dynamic is pretty common for women, I’ve found. Not just in the bedroom but in seduction in general, a lot of the really hot girls who act like complete bitches are doing it because they’re secretly hoping that one day one of the bears they poke will wake up and confidently pin them against a tree. This is why guys who are pussies and back off disappoint them and why they laugh at guys who get all butt-hurt at their shit-tests (“whatever fuckin bitch you’re too ugly for me anyway!! :’( grrrr NEXT!!!”).

      A lot of this comes back to the concept where a girl wants to feel a variety of emotions across the spectrum, even bad emotions, so she gets to experience /\/\/\/\/ instead of an emotional flatline like ——– (which would be boring routine vanilla missionary sex with her husband of 10 years)

      Anyway, don’t do this stuff if you’re a newbie or you’ll end up with rape charges lol this girl was an extreme case and I have a lot of calibration and experience and was safe about it (we had safe words and videos of her giving consent and shit), so don’t try this at home. :P


      • Anon
        on August 23, 2012 at 3:48 pm
        Original Link

        She had a boyfriend?… And you shitted on her?

        I think I just lost all hope in human kind… And at the same time, I have a weird boner.


        • YaReally
          on August 23, 2012 at 11:09 pm
          Original Link

          Fiance. He has no idea she’s like that. They have routine missionary sex where he gets off and goes downstairs to play videogames while she finishes herself off with a vibrator that she has to hide from him because he sees them as competition.



Ovid
on August 23, 2012 at 1:26 pm
Original Link

This is probably one of the most insightful posts of this entire blog.

Here’s a question for the forum: Is it more dominant to dominate a woman erotically – basically turning here into a cock-addicted slut – or to dominate her physically – administering pain in various ways and degrees?

I incline towards the former. I personally have little to no desire to beat a woman or otherwise inflict violence on her. But to erotically awaken that “inner slut” coiled deep inside every girl is a definite aspiration of mine.


  • evilalpha
    on August 23, 2012 at 2:46 pm
    Original Link

    Women don’t separate them. Why should you?


    • Ovid
      on August 23, 2012 at 3:19 pm
      Original Link

      Because I’m just not into whips and cannings and all that.


      • Diomedes
        on August 23, 2012 at 4:51 pm
        Original Link

        There are other avenues. Whip off your belt and choke her with it during foreplay. Punch her in the hips as you’re going doggy. Just before going to the bog tell her that she better be bent over with her naked arse in the air when you get back, smack her like a good little girl and then force it in. Sink your teeth in when you cum.

        Dominant sex does not equal the highly contrived and set up standards of BDSM. The whole idea of planning what implements to use and how, asking a woman how far she wants to take it and then deciding on a safeword is enough to put one off sex due to how far it will take you out of the moment. In addition, the practice of BDSM is intrinsically one where the submissive holds the power.


        • YaReally
          on August 23, 2012 at 10:55 pm
          Original Link

          “The whole idea of planning what implements to use and how, asking a woman how far she wants to take it and then deciding on a safeword is enough to put one off sex due to how far it will take you out of the moment.”

          This is another thing, even if you’re getting into crazy kinky shit, girls like it when it still feels like it “just happened” in the moment. I’ve like, completely planned out a whole session before (“okay I’ll start here and do this to here, then drag her by the hair over to here and use this on her, and put her hands up to where I hid the handcuffs and then cuff her there and–”) but in the moment when the girl shows up I just sweep her away into it and act as if it’s all spontaneous and keep most of it as a surprise for in the moment where on top of the passionate emotions she’s also got a little fear of “wait what?? how did I get handcuffed? oh shit what’s that in his hand?!” etc. I’ve replaced the light in my room with a red one and put together death metal music playlists to boom during the whole thing etc. It’s really a pretty awesome memorable night all around lol

          But If I plan something out like this it’s usually because I’ve hooked up with her a few times and tested the waters and had enough conversations (and enough txt message convos about it to keep me out of jail lol) to have an idea of what all she’d be into and what would be pushing her boundaries etc. so a night like that is a reward for a good fuckbuddy.

          For a normal girl I’m only having one night with or have only just met or an average fuckbuddy I just have a handful of default dominant “moves” I throw out there (slam and pin her against the wall makeout (remember the hand behind her head, I’ve fucked that up before lol), bend her over certain furniture on the way to my room, throw her onto my bed a certain way, etc. etc.).

          “In addition, the practice of BDSM is intrinsically one where the submissive holds the power.”

          Agreed. Her tastes are what determine what we do…my role is more to 1) help her live out her fantasies, and 2) push her boundaries a little bit beyond what she’s expecting because she’ll never ask to have them pushed but often in the moment she’ll go along with it and enjoy it and want more later. Chick I shit on I had been seeing for a few months and escalated things more and more each time. She seriously didn’t seem to have any limit, it was awesome. I can’t even tell friends about the shit her and I did because their idea of kinky is choking a girl lol Fuck that chick was fun.


      • evilalpha
        on August 23, 2012 at 4:51 pm
        Original Link

        Not into or aversion to?


        • Ovid
          on August 23, 2012 at 5:07 pm
          Original Link

          Not into. I’m more interested in turning a completley respectable woman into a depraved sex-addict. You know, secretly lead her down a path of debauchery. That’s all.


          • YaReally
            on August 23, 2012 at 11:00 pm
            Original Link

            You’ll have to screen for submissive chicks who are into the psychological submission. The ones who want to be txted in the middle of the day and told to go to the bathroom and masturbate and send you pics of it. That’s a certain type of woman who’s dying to DO that stuff but is surrounded by guys who don’t know how to read the signs and escalate their relationship to that.

            Means you’re gonna have to hook up with a lot of women and learn to dig into their fantasies and test the waters and not show a single ounce of judgement or madonna/whore complex etc.. There isn’t really any material on doing this, a lot of it comes down to experience with seduction and building comfort/rapport and leading the conversation to sex.

            You can’t turn a girl who has low sex drive or hangups about sex into a depraved sex-addict…but you can take a girl who’s secretly a depraved sex-addict (and may not even realize it) and UNLOCK that in her and become the safe outlet where she can express that stuff. And as 50 Shades of Grey’s sales have demonstrated, a shitload more women are sexually “locked up” than most guys realize. :)


  • Spiralina
    on August 23, 2012 at 9:43 pm
    Original Link

    I think the erotic version works with all women. The physical works with women with strongly developed masochistic tendencies. Which – don’t get me wrong – represents *way* more women than would admit to such tendencies in casual conversation, but doesn’t represent all women.

    The former you can safely try on any version, the latter you might want to suss out first and make sure it’s her particular trigger. And get it in writing :-)


    • YaReally
      on August 23, 2012 at 10:42 pm
      Original Link

      “The former you can safely try on any version, the latter you might want to suss out first and make sure it’s her particular trigger. And get it in writing :-)

      Yep, this.

      I do a lot of screening and qualifying to find out what a girl is into. For some girls it’s more of a kinky turn-on to be told not to wear panties when you go out on a date with her than it is to have clothespins yanked off her clit. This is why I say newbies shouldn’t be fucking with this stuff…I have a pretty consistent set of escalation steps (sometimes verbally (“have you ever had rough sex?” etc. questioning) but mostly physically) I’ve figured out to determine exactly what a girl is into. Like when we first make out I’ll grab her by the hair and see how she responds. If she likes it then I can push a little more and grab her by the jaw as we make out. If she likes that then I can push a little more and choke her against the wall as we make out. If she likes that I can push a little more etc. etc.

      At every single step I’m paying *VERY* close attention to her body-language, what she says, her tone of voice, whimpering, facial expressions, if she hesitates or tries to pull away (for real VS a fake play-fighting pulling away, again this is calibration), whether she gets more into it or gets more nervous, etc. so that I know where to draw the line with that particular girl. It doesn’t mean I can’t convert her down the road, but I’m usually doing this stuff the first time we fuck so she’s not always comfortable enough to go further with someone she’s just met even if down the road she’ll want to.

      I’m also paying attention to taking care of her emotions after it’s all said and done, so she doesn’t feel like a piece of shit whore. There’s a lot of reassuring her that the whole thing was hot and that I had fun and that I thought it was so sexy when she (insert whatever thing here) etc. That stuff also shows her that I’m not judging her like “let’s see what I can get this stupid bitch to do haha now get the fuck out while I go tell my boys about all the sick shit you let me do to you” This stuff helps 1) make her come back for more, and 2) keeps them from getting Buyer’s Remorse and deciding that since she regrets what we did then it must’ve been rape because with all the marks and shit I leave it’d be pretty hard to defend myself in court lol

      I actually visited a kink community thing here, went to a nightclub a night they were having an event and went to the after-party at basically a big sex house dungeon thing where they have weekly swinger and BDSM events. The house was awesome, I’ve considered taking girls there before because they have EVERYTHING lol but the people creeped me out. To me they took the lifestyle waaaaaay too seriously. Guys identifying themselves as Doms and Masters and shit…they all kind of weirded me out. I get it, they’ve found their niche and in that community it probably gets you more pussy to play up the Dom role hardcore and stuff, especially if you’re old and ugly/fat/etc., and they were nice enough dudes I guess.

      But I’m in that middle ground where I just like to have fun in the bedroom and joke around and shit. The slave/master stuff with certain fuckbuddies starts at the door to my place when they arrive but it’s done once we’ve both gotten off a bunch and are done for the night and are just chilling. Then it’s back to playful normal people stuff. I think part of why girls like doing this shit with me is because of that, I treat it like it’s totally normal and not like now they’re my 24/7 slave I own lol I’m like an escape for them from normal life but they know afterward they can go back to their normal life and it won’t be weird between us.

      I like a candlelight and slow romantic night of sex now and then too, don’t get me wrong I’m not a total freak lol I just like variety in my sex life, thus I like to have a variety of girls at hand. I actually don’t really care if a girl is into rough sex or not, I don’t have the goal of making them all super submissive to me or anything…I like variety, so to me I just like the puzzle of figuring out what her fantasies are and bringing those to life. Some guys will call that supplicating (“you should just do whatever you want to her and who cares what she wants”) but those are the guys who’s girls come to me on the side. :)



FFY
on August 23, 2012 at 4:16 pm
Original Link

A girl I’m seeing right now is so fucked in the head from her modeling and having her ass kissed all day that she loves it fucking hardcore.

We dive into this black hole of rougher and rougher sex, where I smack her so hard in the face I think I broke her nose but she wants it even harder. When I choke her while I fuck her she wants me to pass her out. Anytime I think I’m going to far she wants more.

It’s crazy. She even said once she wants to be as degraded as possible. She wants me to piss on her even, but I haven’t decided if I want to pull the trigger on that or not…


  • YaReally
    on August 23, 2012 at 11:14 pm
    Original Link

    Careful. Chicks are stupid as fuck and don’t realize that if you really went “harder” you could legit break parts of her (which especially in her case would affect her modelling career and be extra bad). Try mixing up the pain, where if you’re slapping her and she’s shouting “harder”, do stuff like pinch the fuck out of her nipple, slap her pussy, etc.

    Otherwise, have fun. And buy a shower curtain to lay under your sheets or something if you’re going to get messier lol



Thin-Skinned Masta-Beta
on August 23, 2012 at 4:47 pm
Original Link

Sorry fellas, this little beta seems to get off more on softcore tenderness then the kind of dominance that would enable me to assert my diminished masculine will. Maybe it was the brainwashing by the pervasive modern feminism, maybe the androgen disrupters from modern industrial civilisation polluting the womb that was my first home, however I completely lack the natural edge necessary for the kind of dominance you’re talking about.

Pussy? Not proud to be one, but honest that anything else would be play acting…

I’m not exactly looking for one of the lantern-jawed bitches modern America to dominate me, however only a lady who was at least as innocent and naïve as my own gentle spirit would be an appropriate candidate to stir my effort.

Alas in “progressive” modern society, such specimens of innocent sweetness are as good as extinct.

Maybe I need to join the Amish?

Perhaps I should just consider some synthetic boost (“juice” or “‘roids”) to get the kind of assertive edge I’m lacking by nature?


  • YaReally
    on August 23, 2012 at 11:17 pm
    Original Link

    You can light candles and shit dominantly lol

    It’s more about you’re the one who starts and ends the kissing (whether you pin her against the wall and choke her as you kiss her or whether you romantically pull her in while you’re watching a DVD and softly kiss her, you’re the one who leads things to the bedroom (whether you drag her there on her knees by a fistfull of hair or take her by the hand romantically and walk her there), etc. etc.



The Allure Of Male Dominance

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thwack
on August 24, 2012 at 9:09 am
Original Link

YaReally

The number of girls who’ve not just been okay with not using a condom but actively whined when I put one on is terrifying.
——————————————————————————————————-
Thank God somebody finally said this!

Girls hate condoms because they think its means:

1. You think they are dirty
2. You don’t trust them
3. Both

And further, the propaganda that “its all mens fault because they won’t use condoms” is a WORLD WIDE PHENOMENON.

the spread of AIDS in Africa was blamed on Africa men forcing African women to have “unprotected sex”. Remember all the news reports?

Poor African women, bla bla bla…being forced, bla bla bla…

In those cultures, using a condom with your wife is like calling her a whore! Condoms are for PROSTITUTES!

Women in love with you HATE CONDOMS!

“YaReally” and I can’t be the only guys who know about this?

This is world wide slander, libel, defemation of men and we need to stop it.

Chime in fellas.

They did it to black men,

you’re next


  • Stryker
    on August 24, 2012 at 2:49 pm
    Original Link

    I agree, women don’t like you using condoms if you’re in a relationship with them, and a married man who tries to use condoms when fucking his wife is in for a world of hurt.


    • YaReally
      on August 24, 2012 at 8:50 pm
      Original Link

      Not just relationship women, I’m talking one night stand chicks. The percent of them that give a fuck about using a condom is frighteningly small.

      I suspect part of it is that if a guy has seduced them that fast, they see him as alpha, so it’s not that they’re TRYING to get preggers by him but that they “wouldn’t MIND” it.

      It’s all pretty scary lol



Older Man Game: Direct Or Indirect?

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feral1404
on August 21, 2012 at 5:07 pm
Original Link

I’m 42, am decently successful in the sexual market, and two things jump out right away: First, older men should generally stay out of clubs and the wilder night venues. 30 is about the high point for that behavior, maybe. Older than that and you’re seen as the old creep, leering at the young. Bars are somewhat better. You’re more able to pull off the solo vibe in a bar, especially if you’ve got unreal confidence. But certainly, older men roving in packs is strictly off-putting. It speaks of corporate hacks at a convention away from the wives looking for easy tail. Not good if you want anything other than the slut fives and below. Two, maybe three guys out should be the limit. But certainly a confident, solo older man can swoop if he goes indirect with calm, unshakable game and NO bending; no neediness of any kind. Total indifference to her wanting or not wanting is key. It should seem like you’ve done this thousands of times before. Scripted; smooth; detached. Being sexual creatures, hot young women know what’s coming; they just want to see it done expertly, and they assume that an older man knows what to do.

Second, being introduced into a younger group by a median-aged female is a good strategy. Not someone old enough to be a mother-figure, nor someone young enough to be a peer, but someone the younger females can view as a good judge of character. In other words, you’ve already been vetted. Dinner parties, house parties, gatherings of like-minded people (art crowd, sports crowd, etc.) are decent ways to work into the younger set.

I’m in an outrigger paddling club, and we mix with the younger teams regularly, both in practice and during regattas. Being part of the group takes away the weird older-guy vibe and replaces it with a comfortable comradery. Obviously, for the sports set you need to be in good shape to do something like this; but trust me, if you’re in good shape, even with a touch of gray on the sides, and can walk with confidence, the younger set WILL give you a try.


  • YaReally
    on August 21, 2012 at 7:39 pm
    Original Link

    “First, older men should generally stay out of clubs and the wilder night venues. 30 is about the high point for that behavior, maybe.”

    Nah. Most of the RSD instructors are early 30s. It comes down to your own comfort level though. If you feel like the crowd is “too young” and you’re self-conscious about being there, they’re going to pick up on that vibe from you and you WILL be out of place.

    You can always hit the “old people nightclubs” (most cities have at least one) but then you’re stuck choosing from wrinkly old chicks with baggage lol



tenmagnet
on August 21, 2012 at 5:09 pm
Original Link

I find that the best bet is to just go to a place where young women WANT to meet older men, and then you just go direct. But the secret is finding the place in town where younger women go to meet older guys. It’s not the college pub.


  • YaReally
    on August 21, 2012 at 8:14 pm
    Original Link

    Hey, it’s tenmagnet. Awesome.

    On that note, lovesystems has a 30+ forum at http://www.theattractionforums.com/30-forum/ that’s a solid read for guys hitting the “am I getting too old for this?” self-doubts.

    The RSD forum skews pretty young and the sosuave mature man forum is just awful, so I recommend the lovesystems one if you want more game/PUA specific reading on this stuff (vs manosphere game).



YaReally
on August 21, 2012 at 7:03 pm
Original Link

It’s important for guys (of any age) to understand that Indirect doesn’t mean Asexual.

If you’re obviously older than her, she needs to know you’re a sexual older man who’s been around and knows how to fuck. All you’re doing with indirect is not making it obvious that you’ve chosen her to be the one you want to fuck next. You don’t sit there and talk about Glee lol This means you make sexual jokes, innuendo, comments, talk about sex and sexual stories, get her talking about her fantasies, etc. instead of avoiding all that and being asexual. If she’s into older men, she’ll shoot you IOIs, and then you escalate fast as fuck (you’re an important older man with shit to do, you don’t have time to play txt games for weeks, you don’t have Facebook, etc.).

You also want to bring the vibe that you’re qualifying/screening her a lot more. Most older guys go in with her up on the pedestal since she’s the young hot chick and he’s the “creepy old guy” so naturally he should have to impress her, but you want to approach it from the reverse: You’re the older, mature, experienced, accomplished man and she’s just a silly young girl who hasn’t done shit with her life yet so she should be trying to impress you.

You’re not trying to show her you can fit into her world, you’re trying to decide if she can fit into yours.

I like to drop stuff like “Have you ever been with an older man?” early on, like when they ask my age, because it sets the frame of “I’m sizing you up, sexually, so if you’re not interested you should run away right now” but doesn’t say “I want to fuck you”…it’s just letting her know that you’re already screening her and haven’t decided if you want to fuck her yet.

“I find that some girls are intimidated by older men…but you don’t seem like you’re the type that GETS intimidated, are you?” (qualifying, cold-reading, etc.)

You’re gonna’ get a lot of younger chicks who just completely won’t fuck you because of your age, even if they like you and are attracted to you…the numbers are too much of a mind-fuck for her. Like I met a chick 2 years older than me and she was self-conscious about her being older than me and mentioned “robbing the cradle”. Like, really? 2 YEARS is cradle-robbing?? lol

I don’t like to lie about my age, but sometimes the girl needs (and wants) you to. Actual pre-makeout conversation with a 20yo from the other weekend:

Her: “How old are you?”
Me: “31.”
Her: “No way, you’re not 31. Ew that’s gross, how old are you REALLY?”
Me: “Okay, 26.”
Her: “Whew, good. I’m SO glad you’re not 31…”

She WANTED to make-out, but she needed me to be within the maximum age range she’s always pictured she could get with. And since she was attracted by that point there was no WAY (in her mind) that I could be past that maximum age range because she couldn’t possibly be attracted to someone older than it.

A big thing that helps older guys too, is social proof. Get to know the staff at some regular places and make friends that you can go out with so you look like an important “man-about-town” instead of just a creepy guy with a beer by himself in an 18yo bar doing laps.

Also take care of your grooming and style and shit. A 40yo woman wearing mom-jeans and hair from the 80s isn’t a “hot cougar” lol Get some exercise too, because by 30+ you should have cultivated an interest in taking care of your body. At 20 when you’re scarfing down McD’s every night no one gives a shit, you’re young, you have time to become responsible…but at 30+ you should really be demonstrating “I take care of my health”. Plus you’ll be able to fuck better, and you’ll need the energy to keep up with the young-un’s.

Remember that “What you feel, she feels”, so if you feel like your age difference is weird, she will. If you don’t, she won’t (unless like I said, she has specific hang-ups about going past a certain age range, which lots of the 18yo’s will because they haven’t even fucked a guy their age let alone their dad’s age). And a girl’s biggest fear is social judgement, so don’t go hang out with her and her friends (unless they’re female and you think you can charm them too so they approve). If she’s all “come meet me at BarX” and you go there and she’s there with her 6 18yo orbiter guy-friends in their Abercrombie shit, you shot yourself in the foot lol

Anyway, in summary: For older guys I’d say go indirect and make her qualify herself while making sure the conversation is sexual, and if she’s into you she’ll shoot you an IOI or try to qualify herself to you (“oh my last boyfriend was 35!”) and then you escalate the situation like a motherfucker the second you get that IOI.



Anonymous
on August 21, 2012 at 7:06 pm
Original Link

I’m 36 and haven’t significantly changed my game in 20 years, at least not consciously. While I have gotten older, my girlfriends/hookups have remained the same age, 20-25. Maybe I’ve enjoyed success with younger women simply because I don’t have to ACT like it doesn’t exist. It really doesn’t exist in my mind. It honestly never occurred to me that men shouldn’t date women 15-20 years younger, and it still seems odd to me that others would find the practice disturbing.

I suppose I said all that to simply say this, age difference, in my opinion, is to be simply ignored. If you act like it doesn’t exist, it will cease to exist in her mind very quickly.


  • YaReally
    on August 21, 2012 at 8:03 pm
    Original Link

    “Maybe I’ve enjoyed success with younger women simply because I don’t have to ACT like it doesn’t exist. It really doesn’t exist in my mind. It honestly never occurred to me that men shouldn’t date women 15-20 years younger, and it still seems odd to me that others would find the practice disturbing.”

    This is the right attitude. A lot of guys have been socially conditioned to worry about age differences so it’s hard for them to shift into this mindset. It’s another reason why PUAs stress going out and getting field experience. The more variety of women/ages/classes/etc you meet, the less that stuff bothers you because you gain enough positive reference experiences to not care.

    I’ve banged women from 17 up to 50 lol age doesn’t mean anything to me and I sometimes do a double-take when a girl is concerned about it because I have to think “oh ya, normal people worry about a 2 year age gap, I forgot”



The First SWPL President

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YaReally
on August 19, 2012 at 9:38 pm
Original Link

Oh look, so THIS is where everyone who doesn’t get laid or go out is. I was wondering. Weird that none of the guys who games are posting in this thread…I wonder if there’s a correlation…

brb patiently waiting for the next game article lol



aspic
on August 21, 2012 at 2:19 am
Original Link

I’m a 21 year old male virgin.

If I put my heart and soul into self improvement, when do you think I will have sex for the first time>?

5’11
decent looking/slim
long hair
no car
poor job
average smarts
weird
no friends


  • King A (Matthew King)
    on August 21, 2012 at 1:50 pm
    Original Link

    Just one more kid without a religion. It is impossible to live without a religion (Tillich: one’s “highest concern”), so you will fabricate one, as the gameboys have fashioned a liturgy and scripture out of PUA revelation. Just know that it will be inadequate.

    You are attempting to find a creed that will have you, but in your litany of descriptors you disqualify yourself from initiation into the traveling snake-charmer tent of PUA.com hustlers — until you make full confession of your sins, i.e., renounce your weirdness, and adopt the prayer life of Real Social Dynamic affirmations. Then you can be baptized into the faith, sarging for self-esteem. You will acquire friends, you will sharpen your appearance, you will find plenty of vag, as all but the rankest omegas eventually do by trial and error, and you will hail the pick-up preachers as your liberators.

    Son, your hope resides in finding one of the following: mentor or teacher. One thousand books, seminars, sites, and videos will not equal a fraction of a mentor’s example and personalized training — just as without a sensei/sempai one cannot truly interiorize the martial arts. Either get a Christian alpha mentor, or suffer your way through the charlatans into wisdom. There are exceedingly few of the former, but we’re working on that, alas too late for you.

    Your best bet in the meantime is to adopt, best you can, the methodology of learning: a proper liberal arts education will give you the independence of mind to help you detect the charlatans. Find true religion and accept none of their cheap substitutes. I don’t mean go and plant yourself in a pew somewhere and think osmosis will avail you. I mean perform the conscious habits of examining ultimate concerns. From this habit you will be able to navigate the wisdom and lies of experienced veterans and former chumps who quasi-mentor you from a distance.

    The good news is you are conscious of your inadequacies and you’ve found the place that gives a man the best chance of overcoming those inadequacies. But in the process of weaning yourself away from the unmanly habits our feminist culture insists for you, take care to seek balance as well.

    The PUA revelation is so strong that former chumps place all their hopes in it, when true manliness relies on every virtue — fortitudo (courage), prudentia (wisdom), iustitia (right action), temperantia (restraint). The loudmouths around here will emphasize the former two at the expense of the latter two. The beta is defined as one who exaggerates justice and moderation to the point of making them vices, rightly derided in these precincts as white knightery and timorousness. Meantime the absence of courage and wisdom, an absence corrected by game theory/practice, become objects of exaggerated worship, leading the typical student to reject balance as unbecoming a man.

    But we vouchsafe our victories in restraint, we ratify our newfound freedoms in discipline. Temperantia is the golden mean is the Tao is zen is interior peace … is inner frame, as the PUA will tell you. You must see the virtues at work to keep faith in them. Otherwise you will be tempted to seize the shiniest object of gratification closest to your grasp. These sites are expert at showing a man how to drown himself in happy distraction, but when you are ready to surpass their artificial limits, remember there is more.

    The PUA ethos is an unguided, manic, and righteous attempt to make some good out of the ruins into which we were all born. But what defines a man is what has always defined a man — the virtues. Vir means “man” in Latin; Machiavelli spoke of virtù as indispensable to leadership and the founding of great efforts. There is a robust template for The Good Life from the day-before-yesterday, beyond the urgencies and desperation of survivalists trying to scrape together meaning in a Mad Max milieu of post-apocalyptic sex. Seek ancient wisdom. There is a reason it survives to this day. It outlasts the Billy Mays infomercials of every age that promise short cuts to vulnerable chumps eager to rise above their inadequacies.

    Matt


    • YaReally
      on August 21, 2012 at 6:11 pm
      Original Link

      lol

      Here’s what a year practicing PUA looks like:

      I wonder what a year hanging out with King A and Greg would look like? I bet it would be super duper fun and involve making a ton of friends and growing as an individual.



Hamster Of The Month

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YaReally
on August 19, 2012 at 10:05 am
Original Link

I always like reading the comments by all the women here at Jezebel.com

…wait, what? This is heartiste??

Anyway:



The Right Game For Your Body Type: The Ectomorph

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Don Julian
on August 16, 2012 at 4:08 pm
Original Link

Reading the other two installments I had agreed with Yareally’s horoscope comparison but to be honest reading this makes a lot of sense to me, I’m not thin any more so I didn’t identify as 100% ecto but my wrists are still really thin and personality wise it hit close to home a bunch of times.


  • YaReally
    on August 16, 2012 at 5:53 pm
    Original Link

    lol and this EXACT thought process you wrote out is why fortune tellers, psychics, horoscope writers, and mediums have been making money for hundreds of years and why us PUAs get laid.

    I give up lol


    • Don Julian
      on August 17, 2012 at 2:07 pm
      Original Link

      ha :) maybe you’re right man but it is noteworthy that one of the three resonates more than the others, and it happens to be the one closest to my bone structure. I can see that it overgeneralises (like a lot of the writing here). I guess a lot of it could just be down to the fact that most of the ectomorph description corresponds to introversion.


      • YaReally
        on August 17, 2012 at 7:36 pm
        Original Link

        “one of the three resonates more than the others”

        Yes, what are the odds that if you split a massive list of very common characteristics into three lists and attribute each of them to things that billions of people have, that someone would have both that attribute and a handful of those common characteristics?

        This is the EXACT same logic girls use when they say “omg I know horoscopes are fake but my scorpio one REALLY hits home omg it might be true”.

        It’s actually amazing to me that logical males STUDYING psychology can’t see this lol

        Thing is the personality types are pretty valid, it’s the attributing them to complete nonsense that is the issue. Might as well say Scorpios are outgoing and loud, Geminis are quiet and thoughtful, and Libras are in-between. Complete nonsense and just one more thing to make guys stress “omg this is impossible for me because I’m This and This. You guys who are That and That don’t understand, it’s not that I’m a pussy who doesn’t push himself, it’s that I have all these tough excuses to overcome that other people dont!!!”

        Barf. Part of what made Tyler good is that he believes 100% that anything anyone else can do in game, he can do, no excuses. That’s why he learned the game of a tall magician, and a short bald guy, and now goes direct like good looking guys, etc etc That didn’t make it into the article though, weird. :P pretty sure Tyler would be the first one to laugh at this silly shit lol



The Right Game For Your Body Type: The Mesomorph

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via Heartiste

RappaccinisDaughter
on August 15, 2012 at 3:18 pm
Original Link

You know what would be a good read? A piece on short-guy game. There are things a man can do to modify (not completely change, of course) his somatotype. But there’s nothing to be done about height.

Not that the above isn’t a good read; sweet “Clockwork Orange” reference. Just a thought.


  • Pedro
    on August 15, 2012 at 3:55 pm
    Original Link

    Yeah, one of my BEST FRIENDS that also reads about game is VERY short and skinny. He had put some muscles on but he is naturally skinny, so it has been real hard for him.

    I want to make him my wingman, but his shortness is something I think can be a significant drawback, because I am 6’8″ tall. It looks just funny.


    • RappaccinisDaughter
      on August 15, 2012 at 4:29 pm
      Original Link

      I know a guy who is maayyyybe 5’4″ and he’s a total babeslayer. Only dates 8s and up. So I know it can be done. (And no, I’ve never asked him how…there’s kind of an implied insult in the question. I’d feel rude asking.)


      • YaReally
        on August 15, 2012 at 5:44 pm
        Original Link

        I know a 5’2″ guy who regularly attracts hot girls (even tall chicks lol). He’s not a PUA, more of a Natural, but he has shitty endgame so while he gets a bunch of attraction (that objectively you wouldn’t expect him to be able to get, esp from the girls he gets it from), he has trouble closing the deal because he fucks up a bunch of game principles and gets ASD/LMR and doesn’t know how to handle flaking. If he learned just a bit of endgame stuff he would be unstoppable but as most gamers know you can’t teach someone game unless they WANT to learn it.

        I’ve picked his brain a bit and we go way back so I’ve observed what he does and his general mindset. I also have another buddy, same height, who actively wants to learn game but is starting from the complete opposite place as the first guy, so I’ve looked at the contrast between how the two of them act and why one gets attraction from girls while the other doesn’t and it’s all pretty consistent/logical.

        I’ll write some shit up when I get some free time.

        Also for the record I’m 5’9″ and my friends who game with me are anywhere from 5’2″-6’6″, and a variety of body types/shapes, as well as a variety of races.


      • Allerious
        on August 16, 2012 at 11:54 am
        Original Link

        Highly doubt it unless we’re talking about the over 25 crowd, in which case those “8′s” need to be qualified as “8′s by over-25 standards”.

        What’s his profession?


        • YaReally
          on August 16, 2012 at 2:06 pm
          Original Link

          Bartender. That should tell you a lot right there lol

          Bartending has basically given him a shitload of practice 1) building comfort quickly with strangers, 2) flirting, 3) teasing/negging/qualifying girls (for being/saying dumb stuff while drinking), 4) not taking girls seriously (he’s surrounded by hot girls including his co-workers thanks to his environment so they’re not a scary intimidating thing to him), 5) leading/ordering/scolding (he works in a pub where he’s basically the top dog of the chain), 6) tons of social proof cause the guys at his pub all think he’s cool and lots of regulars give him props all night, 7) shit-tons of practice both befriending guys and AMOGing them to encourage them to drink more and not be pussies, and to tool them back with a barrage of Russell Brand style wit if they dare try to tool him about his height (he’s already heard every joke you can make about it and he’s got a dozen killer comebacks that will leave you stunned and looking like a retard in front of your girl and your buddies (who will all cheer for him and laugh at you with him because we love when our friends get owned unexpectedly)), and 8) he has practice expressing himself 100% from swearing when he’s mad to having deep philosophical convos over a beer to making dirty jokes etc no censorship at all and 9) he has no approach anxiety at all because he expect people to like him and he’s had hundreds of thousands of conversations with people from all walks of life so he knows there’s nothing to be scared of or have anxiety over.

          Girls will be hanging on their BFs arm up doing a shot and my buddy will tool the guy a bit and the guy will love him for it because that’s how drunk guys work (now he has status, and the admiration of her BF) and the girl will start flirting with him and completely ignore her BF and occasionally slip him her number etc. Its a mindfuck every time I see it but it’s makes sense when you analyze it through game goggles.

          Would he be able to take down a loud nightclub full of jersey shore douches solo? Probably not. But he can cause a helluva scene at a pub and when he goes to restaraunts and in daytime environments (grocery store, mall, running errands, etc) which are where he meets most of the girls he meets. Hell by default he’s peacocked being that short so he’s already one-up on the generic average guy in terms of being noticed when he walks into a room.

          Most of the stuff he gets from bartending translates to daygame. He’ll walk into a relatively quiet pub mid-afternoon and he knows eyes are on him. He’ll be loud and start cracking jokes and building comfort with the bartender and whoever’s on a stool beside him. From there other people wonder “who is this guy?” and start trying to get on his radar just out of curiosity. He tools a girl for doing something dumb (like ordering a gay drink or wincing after doing a shot with her BF) and then she starts wanting his validation so she starts qualifying to him. Now everyone is seeing a girl validating herself to this little guy so naturally out come the AMOGs to try to take her but he owns them with his wit because he’s run into tools like them all his life and he tools them in a way where they love him after, so now he’s got the girl qualifying, the guys buying him drinks, the girl’s girlfriends asking her about him, and the whole time the hot bartender chick from the start is watching his status rocket up through the roof and starts flirting. Now everyone sees the hot bartender flirting with him and hypergamy kicks in…

          Etc etc etc. it’s pretty amazing to watch. It’s like this huge snowball effect. Everyone, even myself, falls into his frame and he sets the tone of the room and socially takes over. He’s just like a social tornado going through the room and everyone else ends up swept up into it.

          If you’re super short, you don’t have to become a bartender but if you can develop the same attitudes my buddy has through other means (like massive field experience doing pickup), pick specific types of environments to game in, and learn to work a crowd, you can structure a lifestyle where you’re getting girls other guys wouldn’t expect you to be able to get.

          Compare him to the short guy with a big chip on his shoulder about his height and a bunch of insecurities who thinks you need tons of money to get girls so he works 80hrs a week at his office job (when he’s not at the gym getting overly jacked which just highlights his Manlet insecurity) and occasionally makes it out of his mansion for happy hour where he’s surrounded by his boss who he has to behave in front of and play beta to, and his rich confident co-workers who barely know him because he works too much, in a loud bar environment where he doesn’t know anyone and has to compete with a bunch of other guys and he orders his drink meekly and quietly from the waitress in his big group of guys who are all awkwardly trying to hit on her.

          Like I say tho, he gets beautiful opportunities but he’s still socially conditioned enough (never taken the red pill) to often fuck up the end game by getting white-knighty when the girl is hot and he realizes he has a chance lol. If he tightened that up he’d be killer. He still gets laid, but not as much as he COULD be lol


        • RappaccinisDaughter
          on August 16, 2012 at 2:10 pm
          Original Link

          He’s over 25, but the women I’ve seen him with are not. I’d rather not reveal his profession because he could potentially be identifiable if I did, despite the fact that he is not “famous.” It’s just…this is a small world that he and I occupy. (We are colleagues.)
          I will tell you it’s kind of badass, although not particularly lucrative.


          • YaReally
            on August 16, 2012 at 5:31 pm
            Original Link

            Lol he probably was, the formatting on this gets hard as fuck to follow on my iPhone. But I planned to write about my buddy anyway and that Q make a good starting point so hey lol



YaReally
on August 15, 2012 at 6:03 pm
Original Link

sigh lol

Body type != personality type. Go out and interact with a wider variety of people.

Mental masturbation. This is just one huge cold read based on cartoon stereotypes.

Psychic/PUA: “I bet that a lot of people underestimate you, but I think you’re the type of person who likes to hold back and let other people shine in the spotlight before having your turn.”

Every girl in the universe: “OMG that is SO me!! Wow how do you know my SOUL???”

It’s exactly the same as assigning vague applicable-to-pretty-much-anyone stereotypes based on completely arbitrary things like the month you were born, the color of your hair, etc. except that this crowd is more looks-obsessed since it involves new low self-esteem red-pill’ers still trying to detach from social conditioning, so while basing your day on a horoscope or assuming blondes are dumber seems “silly” this seems like “obvious science”.

Chicks will respond the same way too, “oh it’s OBVIOUS if you just observe people that horoscopes are totally real.” except that we’d rightly laugh at them for that.

Next article’ll be the ecto one so I’ll probably just be back next week, I can’t take reading this or reading the comments lol so don’t worry no more YaReally rants on this.



Flushing the Nest

Original Link

via Rational Male

YaReally
on August 14th, 2012 at 7:29 pm
Original Link

@Rooster

A Natural buddy and I both do that. It works exactly like DavidD says it will lol plus it’s also fucking hilarious.

It’s a little trickier when you’ve been dating her for a bit and she wants to leave a toothbrush (vs the territory-marking “leave-behind” DavidD’s talking about). I’ve allowed them to leave hairbrushes or toothbrushes but I make them leave them out of sight (under the sink, in my closet, etc) which takes the fun out of it for them because half the reason was to mark their territory for other girls.


YaReally
on August 14th, 2012 at 7:39 pm
Original Link

On Hithard’s issue, don’t stress it dude. It comes down to the saying “I could be happy being poor if I’d never been rich.” People settle for shitty significant others because they have scarcity. They literally can’t even comprehend how you could toss a girl for something that to them would be so slight.

But you know what you want as a man, you expect a certain standard of behavior from the people around you and you demand certain things from the woman you allow to be lucky enough to be on your arm. Why would you ever apologize for that? Ya think any of the manginas begging for permission from their fat nagging wives to watch the Superbowl could be described like that? Fuck no.

The woman you settle with could one day be raising your kids and have access to half your money etc. It would be ridiculous to settle for less than you want.


The Right Game For Your Body Type: The Endomorph

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anon
on August 14, 2012 at 6:11 pm
Original Link

Endomorph = House Party
Mesomorph = Night club/bars
Ectomorph = Day Game or otherwise 1 on 1 and more private venues

Thoughts?


  • Nepenthe
    on August 15, 2012 at 5:10 am
    Original Link

    Interesting point. I’m definitely Endo and have my best strike rate in house parties and social circle game. Basically 0 in the other two.

    As a mostly unrelated aside, male looks seem to become disproportionately important to women the more liberal the society.


    • YaReally
      on August 15, 2012 at 12:23 pm
      Original Link

      Do you do better in house parties because of your body type or because you don’t have as much experience working clubs etc compared to hanging with friends? Or because you’re more self conscious or feel like there’s more competition etc in other environments? Or because you don’t know how to project your voice over loud music? Or are more nervous cold-approaching in a room full of strangers over warm-approaching at a house party? Or don’t believe you can get (or simply don’t want) certain types of girls (shit-testing girls with their guard up vs easy chill laid-back girls at a house party) over others? Or believe that a house party is easier and create your own self-fulfilling prophecy?

      When Tyler first appeared on the scene he HATED nightclubs. You can read his old posts in his archives about it…he started out as a daygamer and did fine with that. He had no idea how to game in clubs/bars and he had the exact same complaints that every other guy new to night game had (loud music, competition, bitchy girls, etc). He posted a bunch asking for advice and posting his frustrations and basically forced himself to learn to do night game. Now he and his instructors are probably THE most solid night game PUAs out there. His body type was irrelevant, it came down to game and forging the right skillset for the environment he wanted to game in.

      If he had gone “oh well I’m this body type and a man’s gotta know his limits so I should just stick to daygame” we wouldn’t have half the techniques we use today. But he understood that being in this limiting headspace was useless and just going to hold him back.



YaReally
on August 14, 2012 at 6:39 pm
Original Link

Next up: how to game based on your zodiac sign!!!! Do you have brown hair instead of blonde?? Here’s the method for YOU!!!

All the personality stuff in this is retarded. The looks advice is good tho (own your size and understand that girls like that you can protect them, wear a pimp suit instead of a wife beater showing your man-tits, lift some weights so you’ve got some beef instead of just fat, etc). Not because girl’s give a shit but because it shows you’re 1) socially competent/savvy, 2) you take enough pride in yourself to take care of your presentation, and 3) you’ll feel better about yourself when you look in the mirror which will reflect in your attitude around women.

Bullshit broad paint-strokes based on completely arbitrary shit like “Where endomorphs are weak is in their neediness for approval and in their aptness to slip into “entertainment monkey” game.” just fuck with guys. Some already aloof endo read that and said “oh what? I’m a dancing monkey, okay time to be more aloof” and is now standing in a corner ignoring all the girls wondering why he’s not getting laid. And some clown-ass ecto read that and said “oh endos are more entertaining so I’d better step that up in my game!!” and is now running around with a seltzer bottle and clown nose.

Society stereotypes and categorizes and labels because chaos is scary to them. It’s scary when something doesn’t follow the labels/rules it’s supposed to. That’s why your friends hold you back when you try to learn game, they want you to stay in your label they have for you. That’s why guys avoid approaching and say “oh that’s just not me. I’m an introvert and introverts behave like blah blah”. That’s why guys with money can’t accept that tons of guys are getting laid just as much or more without money. That’s why girl’s don’t want the “nice guy” to learn game and become an “asshole”.

Learning pickup involves stomping all over the faces of limiting beliefs and labels, both your own and the ones society tries to trap you in (including scientists who don’t get laid and their gay “studies”, these guys wouldn’t be able to comprehend half the shit we can do in the field).

Tyler said it best: “Put me in ANY one of your bodies and I’ll pick up. Exactly like I do now.”


  • YaReally
    on August 14, 2012 at 6:48 pm
    Original Link

    just to clarify: I’m not saying a big fat guy doesn’t have to focus on different parts of game than a small skinny guy. Both have to demonstrate that they can protect the girl and connect with her blah blah blah

    I basically take issue with your body type determining your personality and your game strengths/weaknesses. The aloof endo and the aloof ecto


    • YaReally
      on August 14, 2012 at 6:53 pm
      Original Link

      boooo my fatty fat fingers bumped Send too soon lol plz delete!


    • jerk
      on August 14, 2012 at 7:24 pm
      Original Link

      “I basically take issue with your body type determining your personality and your game strengths/weaknesses.”

      It seems likely that the connection between body type and personality type is that body type is a function of personality type. Your personality determines how much you exercise and eat to a great degree.

      Your body type, like your body language, also affects how your personality is perceived by others. For instance, the point about endomorphs working well with mixed groups because they aren’t threatening to other males is spot on. A more fit body type is going to raise red flags, while a skinny dude is more likely to arouse other males’ bullying instincts.


      • YaReally
        on August 15, 2012 at 4:33 am
        Original Link

        “Your personality determines how much you exercise and eat to a great degree.”

        Dunno, hit up the bodybuilding.com forums and you’ll find tons of both shy low self esteem introverts and overly confident alpha jock extroverts all working on their bodies for various reasons but at first glance they all look the same.

        ” For instance, the point about endomorphs working well with mixed groups because they aren’t threatening to other males is spot on. A more fit body type is going to raise red flags, while a skinny dude is more likely to arouse other males’ bullying instincts.”

        This is as silly as the “what if both guys have exactly equal game but one is better looking huh??” question (two guys don’t HAVE the same game, it’s not an RPG stat you can compare down to a %, the whole question is mental masturbation by guys who don’t go out stressing about ridiculous hypothetical scenarios).

        Yes, if each of those 3 body types just sits down with a mixed group and motionlessly stares straight ahead for 10 minutes, they’ll get those responses. But that’s not a thing that happens. You sit down and you engage the people in the group, like a normal human being, and use some game to win the group over. The 1.5 nanoseconds that their subconscious judged who you might stereotypically be based on yours looks is completely steamrolled over by your personality and the interaction.

        It’s like asking “well girls like big penises so if a small penis guy and a large penis guy both approach a girl naked then she’ll like the large penis guy right?”. This isn’t a scenario that happens in the real world unless you are completely socially retarded lol

        In fact this ENTIRE article (no offense, I heart heartiste) just REEKS of approval seeking and “how can I get everyone to like me and risk the least amount of social pressure or bad feelings” which is by default worrying about what everyone may hypothetically think about you in some scenario where you display absolutely no personality at all.

        ugh. The next article might as well be “how to attract girls based on how much money you have in the bank” or “based on what color of shirt you’re wearing…red could be perceived as a THREAT so if you wear a red shirt make sure you make more jokes than when you wear a blue shirt!! Change your personality to fit into what you think other people will like, don’t think for yourself, don’t express yourself as you are, just suck up to everyone because it’s impossible to recover from a bad hypothetical first impression!!”

        didn’t expect to rant this much on this topic lol. Originally I was just going to write “lol retarded.”


  • YaReally
    on August 14, 2012 at 6:52 pm
    Original Link

    just to clarify: I’m not saying a big fat guy doesn’t have to focus on different parts of game than a small skinny guy. Both have to demonstrate that they can protect the girl and connect with her blah blah blah

    I basically take issue with your body type determining your personality and your game strengths/weaknesses. The aloof endo and the aloof ecto will run into the same problems. The dancing monkey endo and dancing monkey ecto will run into the same problems. An aloof/monkey mes will run into the same problems as the other two guys.

    And if you haven’t met an aloof endo or a dancing monkey ecto, you need to go out more, meet more types of people from a wider variety of social circles, and watch more of them interacting with women.


    • YaReally
      on August 14, 2012 at 7:04 pm
      Original Link

      (for the record I took two chicks off a massive aloof intimidating bodybuilder and his extroverted yappy ecto buddies this weekend. Big aloof dude needed to be more interesting/fun and the ectos needed to tone it back and DQ more)

      When you go out enough you don’t even see guys physical appearance, all you see is their vibe and you can summarize who they are, what their personality type is, how good their game is, what style of game they run, what moves they’ll make, etc in an instant. Chess is still chess and is played exactly the same way whether the pieces are carved out of wood or just rocks with a letter on them.

      (also the bodybuilder didn’t kill me tho he clearly wanted to punch me all night lol but I was using standard Mystery Method (ignore her, befriend the group, make her chase me) so he couldn’t justify punching me. He knew I was doing SOMETHING but couldn’t tell exactly what or how to stop it. She made fun of him later after we fucked and were talking about the night)


    • YaReally
      on August 15, 2012 at 5:32 am
      Original Link

      One more lol:

      On top of being a ridiculous notion to begin with, this article is also completely ignoring the concepts of frame control and self-fulfilling prophecies. If you’re an ecto and you fill your head with this garbage and walk up thinking “okay I’m an ecto so this group is going to be more likely to bully me”, you are going to get bullied. Not because you’re an ecto but because your sub-communications all aligned with your expectations and they picked up on it and, since most people ping off their environment for how to react, they do exactly what you expect and bully you.

      If you’re an ecto and go up fully expecting the alpha guys to respect and like you, they will. This is like the guy who has no money approaching. If he doesn’t give a shit about having no money and still expects the girl to like him, she will. If he’s stressing that he doesn’t have a BMW and she probably only likes guys with BMWs, it will go bad.

      Another example is learning martial arts and gaining confidence and exuding a vibe that you aren’t to be messed with…suddenly people stop messing with you like they did before you developed that vibe. Same with a guy who can handle shit-tests…he stops getting shit-tested as much because girls can sense that.

      This is especially true with girls who ping off their environment for how to react more than guys do. “what you feel, she feels”. If you 100% believe and expect your size to creep her out, it will, if you expect it to make her feel like you can protect her, it will. She’s looking to you for how to react because as a man your frame is supposed to be stronger.

      There are just so many things wrong with this article on so many levels and the entire science behind it reeks of ivory tower type lack of seduction experience.



The Right Game For Your Body Type: The Endomorph

Original Link

via Heartiste

Dr. Grzlickson
on August 14, 2012 at 10:26 pm
Original Link

A woman wrote this post, I’d put money on it.


  • YaReally
    on August 15, 2012 at 4:36 am
    Original Link

    It honestly sounds like the kind of stuff Aunt Sue over at hookingupsmart writes.



Reality vs. The Internet

Original Link

via Rational Male

YaReally
on August 13th, 2012 at 8:52 pm
Original Link

Non-gamers use this argument all the time. “it’s probably all made up I mean there’s entire communities dedicated to writing Twilight fan fiction!!”

Here’s the low-down in field reports:

1) there are hundreds of thousands of them. If you read a handful of field reports you are doing the equivalent of a scientist doing a survey of a handful of people. If you read thousands of them, you start to notice consistent patterns in them and the anomalies stand out more. It’s not issues with lingo, it’s issues with “the response that guy got was unusual and illogical, doesn’t follow PUA principles, and is different from the way girl’s responded in the other thousand reports I’ve read”

2) they’re a supplement to going out, not a replacement for going out. When you go out, you run into similar situations as others do in their field reports. You gain first-hand experience of which reports make sense and align with the combination of the thousands of reports you’ve read combined with the thousands of interactions you’ve had in real life from going out in the field and testing things regularly.

3) there are definitely fake reports as well as a lot of exaggeration in them in the quality of girls. Often there are important nuances left out as well (“this girl approache me” “what were you wearing” “a rainbow Mohawk” “fucking mention that then”). This is where you combine all the thousands of reports you’ve read and the consistent patterns you’ve noticed, plus combine your real life in-field experience, plus a healthy dose of skepticism, and then use that awesome thing called critical thinking.

4) it seems unlikely that someone can remember an integration and conversation in the amount of detail that field reports often contain, but try it sometime. When you go out sober and are specifically paying attention to your interactions for the sake of learning and improving your game and noticing your sticking points, and you write the report when you get home, you’ll be surprised at how much your brain was actually capable of remembering.
If you are a newbie to game, or don’t go out and regularly approach people, every field report will sound fake.

Learning PUA is not a weekend of investment. It’s a years-long process. Whether that much work/effort/time is worth the end result is up to the individual but you don’t become a solid PUA by half-assing it.

When you go out a lot it gets pretty easy to tell if a report is fake (ie – it doesn’t jive with all the experience and principles you’ve seen consistently in action over and over) and spot who’s a keyboard jockey. It also helps weed out hookers and strippers etc (girls who fake interest in you) as well as fake guys who are trying to subtly tool you or bullshit you because you can tell “there’s no logical reason for this person to give the ioi they just gave, I’ve done nothing that should stimulate that response”. This also translates into spotting easy lays and difficult lays quickly.


YaReally
on August 13th, 2012 at 9:16 pm
Original Link

Also in situations where something DOES seem unusual, generally what happens (or at least used to happen before pickup went mainstream and we got a bunch of tards flooding into the community) is that the person who wrote the report is asked a bunch of questions from everyone, trying to figure out if there are details/nuances left out that would explain the unusual result (“she fucked me as soon as I said hello” “wtf? Where was she?” “in my audience when I was playing my guitar on stage”).

On top of that, the more studious PUAs will go out and try to duplicate the situation a bunch of times to see if they can trigger the same results. This is where a lot of modern direct game came from…along the lines of “hey I didn’t use an opinion opener, I just said she was cute and I wanted to say hi” “no way that worked im gonna try it!! …holy shit everyone it worked!” “what?? I’m trying it too then! Wow it worked!” “maybe we don’t need opinion openers?” and a new little evolution in game happens.

Then even MORE studious and analytical PUA types (the Tyler Durden level guys) try to break everything down into consistent principles to explain/teach why two seemingly opposing methods are producing the same result. This would be the stage where we figure out that both a stereotypical alpha jock and a stereotypical Johnny Depp intense artist are both alpha because of their frame control and beliefs and how they demonstrate those to women, not based on their looks or hobbies etc.

Tyler was one of the most influential PUAs back in the day almost purely because he has an analytical mind and was putting together puzzle pieces other guys didn’t realize were connected, AND could explain why they fit together. Thus lots of his old posts were extremely long and in-depth.

So ya, we have some ways to weed out a lot of fake reports. They just require effort and leaving your computer room. We even had a section back in the day dedicated to tactics/techniques where it was required that you tested a technique out 3+ times successfully before even posting about it. Then those would get tested by a ton of guys to weed out nuances or specific situations it only works in or label it as bullshit etc.


Reality vs. The Internet

Original Link

via Rational Male

YaReally
on August 14th, 2012 at 7:13 pm
Original Link

@Solo

Agree completely with everything you wrote, including the assessment of the communities at the end.

It’s hard for people now to understand how much field experience was stressed back in the underground days. Theorists (aka certain regular commenters in the manosphere who very clearly don’t go out) were laughed at if they didn’t rigorously test their controversial theories.

Part of why I hit Heartiste and this blog is that both authors writing jives with game concepts. Even if they aren’t out in the field testing it, what they’re saying doesn’t contradict it.


Beta Males Settle For Fat Chicks

Original Link

via Heartiste

Johann Happolati
on August 13, 2012 at 3:06 pm
Original Link

SHOCKING STUDY SHOWS BEGGARS CAN’T BE CHOOSERS!


  • Whammer
    on August 13, 2012 at 6:44 pm
    Original Link

    So called “science” only tells us what we already knew and attempts to explain it. But I don’t see how any beta who has the traits that repel females is going to learn to be Alpha. He just can’t grow another 6″ or hide those nervous sweat stains under his armpits or his shaky beta voice that cracks at the slightest provocation. Whether you think so or not, females are very visual and have already rejected unsuitable men on sight. It’s virtually impossible to overcome this rejection and no amount of talk or “game” is going to do it.And besides, is it really even worth it.


    • YaReally
      on August 13, 2012 at 8:25 pm
      Original Link

      I know you’re a troll so I’m putting as little effort into this response as possible:

      “hide those nervous sweat stains under his armpits or his shaky beta voice that cracks at the slightest provocation.”

      Guess people attending Toastmasters and comedians, musicians, etc doing live shows week after week are all fucked then hey? Trolling used to mean something, jeeze.



YaReally
on August 13, 2012 at 4:22 pm
Original Link

Don’t forget the extra high end of the standards spectrum. The virgins, keyboard jockeys, and guys huddling in groups of chode-crystals in the club with a drink up at their chest judging girls walking by instead of talking to them…aka the guys who don’t get laid but spout “pointy elbow” judgements lol

Those guys always make me laugh. “I wouldn’t fuck her.”. No, you COULDN’T fuck her.

You can’t have “standards” until you can actually get women.



ATC
on August 13, 2012 at 7:12 pm
Original Link

I’m a fidgety Game-practicing spaz still getting AMOGed by my naturally Greater Beta buddy whose moves have only changed a little since 2004. (Heartiste gave me an Alpha Assessment rating of 3 a few years back)

So ( Greater Omega + Game ) by way of Steve Sailer) I realized he was the classic Greater Beta. Great at rambling, peacocking, DHV spikes, social proof. Plenty of 7’s, a few 8’s, but he made “mistakes” that my Lesser Alpha buddies (9’s) don’t – smiling a lot, very slow with kino, giving little trinket gifts (not lock-in props) early on, addressing just the target.

At any rate, he’s back in town and I figured by now I could match this guy in the field, but no. The guy is a frickin’ laser for approaching the hottest accessible-looking target immediately. If you’re following the three-second rule he’s following the “I approached her yesterday” rule.

Lessons? 1) nature always looks for a way to trump nurture, 2) he who approaches first approaches best.


  • YaReally
    on August 13, 2012 at 8:32 pm
    Original Link

    Your biggest problem is that you’re comparing yourself to him and give a shit if he’s better. Do you think he’s stressing if he’s better than you? Even if he talks shit and challenges you (“I bet I can get her before you can!”) do you think he’s really bothered by it either way?

    “Whoever is reacting to the other person more is the one with lower value.”



The Nuclear Neg

Original Link

via Heartiste

YaReally
on August 8, 2012 at 2:35 pm
Original Link

Riiight…that was an extremely logical conversation to have with apparently the most self-aware *18 year old* in the universe lol

I say troll, or exaggerated/missing pieces of the story (his job is as an evo-psych teacher and she knows it, or they’ve had evo-psych conversations before, or they’ve known eachother a long time where this is like a field report of getting a makeout with your wife, etc), or complete Russian Roulette fluke that would have an extremely low success rate if applied on a larger sample.

I’ve verbalized game theory and the seduction process with girls and gotten laid with it but like describing it to normal AFC friends, I leave the nerdy lingo out of it.

All in all I wouldn’t recommend guys try this. Especially not on a co-worker…it’s really socially awkward stuff to say lol


  • Anonymous
    on August 8, 2012 at 3:48 pm
    Original Link

    Nothing big missing from the story. She and her friends had hung out at my place for quite awhile and knew I was dating hot women a little older than herself. She threw out what she thought was a compliment “We’d be a couple if you were younger” and didn’t expect me to see the backhand in that compliment and insult her back so hard. It’s a shit test when a girl tells a guy that he’s too old for her.

    He’s got to respond with something non-bitter that tells her that, no, he’s not too old for her.

    I wrote in that comment that I probably did not need to do this particular nuclear neg. She was only saying that we probably couldn’t marry or meet her parents, which doesn’t mean a rejection on other counts.

    It worked. Her friends were on my side. It would be a mistake to do this with the wrong woman and get her friends all against you.

    At least we can all agree that CH is doing this kind of nuclear neg on a mass scale via this blog.


    • corvinus
      on August 8, 2012 at 3:55 pm
      Original Link

      She threw out what she thought was a compliment “We’d be a couple if you were younger” and didn’t expect me to see the backhand in that compliment and insult her back so hard. It’s a shit test when a girl tells a guy that he’s too old for her.

      “I know it’s not fair but the fact remains that us men stay attractive longer.” –Onslow, Keeping Up Appearances (the only alpha in that show IMO)

      Women will readily admit that they mature faster than men, and even that dating older men is far more common than men dating older women.


      • Anonymous
        on August 8, 2012 at 4:22 pm
        Original Link

        Exactly, and the direction I want to see the manosphere go is one where men aren’t afraid they will be rejected by women for speaking the truth to them about evo psych.

        Because this CH blog is a big waste of time if we keep the truth all bottled up inside of us in some grand play to ‘indirectly seduce women with our secret knowledge of evo psych’.

        Hotties can handle the truth better than older women can. That’s for sure.

        In fact, ONLY a teenager can be nuclear negged directly like above.

        But, it is OK, if a man and his girlfriend are out with her female friends and, if one of the girls says “that guy over there looks cute and rich but he must be 35 so he’s too old for me”, the man can politely and without bitterness advise his girlfriend’s pal that she’ll possibly be missing out on the chance of a lifetime if she doesn’t reconsider that attitude.

        Rule #1 is not to be bitter and to maintain frame.


        • YaReally
          on August 8, 2012 at 5:31 pm
          Original Link

          Rule #2 is to have a sample source of more than 1. ;) Run this on a dozen chicks and let us know how it goes.


        • corvinus
          on August 8, 2012 at 6:23 pm
          Original Link

          But, it is OK, if a man and his girlfriend are out with her female friends and, if one of the girls says “that guy over there looks cute and rich but he must be 35 so he’s too old for me”, the man can politely and without bitterness advise his girlfriend’s pal that she’ll possibly be missing out on the chance of a lifetime if she doesn’t reconsider that attitude.

          I’m 30, and I run my game on college-age girls. In fact, I’d go down to 16 if it was legal in this state. My current #1 target is 18.

          Another thing for guys to remember:

          Of the college-age girls I’ve been with recently, only one questioned me as to why I was seeing her despite being considerably older than her. She was also a hard-core leftist from a broken family, and later got knocked up by a Mexican deadbeat. So judging from my fairly limited experience, “looking askance at older men” = “potential single mom”.

          Yeah, I know it’s anecdotal… but it makes sense. Leftist women have the opinion that older men hitting on them is exploitation by the patriarchy, and are taught to consider it icky, primitive, backward, and violating the equality between men and women. Leftists ardently believe you’re supposed to be about the same age as your partner, to have similar income levels… well, to be “equal”.


          • YaReally
            on August 9, 2012 at 12:16 am
            Original Link

            Arizo: cause by 25 she’ll be my sloppy seconds and she’ll be thinking of me when you fuck her.

            lol



blert
on August 8, 2012 at 2:36 pm
Original Link

Much, much too wordy.

I can’t believe that ANY young babe could possibly believe that the hour glass is running out – - until a decade has passed.

At every turn around her, she’s receiving affirmations of lust and value.

Much is missing if this account is remotely correct.


  • Anonymous
    on August 8, 2012 at 4:05 pm
    Original Link

    What you say is sadly true for the “Sex and the City” culture of the US, Canada and Great Britain. There, women often don’t get it that they might hit something called a wall until they are around 27 (and in SATC Carrie was 37 before she acknowledged the existence of a wall).

    But I’m telling you that this is not the standard biologically driven psychology of most females.

    Keep them away from feminists and they will see age 25 as the moment when the wall hits.

    Note this girl argued in the texts that she felt she had until age 25 to win all the men. She was admitting that it would come early and we only argued about how early.

    If she were an American feminist, she would not want to discuss such logic and, in the rare case that one would, she would use “equalist theory” along these lines:

    “Sure, I’ll get less good looking as I get older, but so will you and I will still be dating men my age and you will still need to date women your own age, so you still lose”.

    That is feminist logic. Any woman who uses this logic will certainly dislike the guy who is “too dense” to understand that “reality”.

    But that’s only because the mangina culture she’s surrounded by is backing her up on this.

    Take her out of that culture, put her among men who don’t think twice about reminding girls of the shortness of their SMV cycles, and when one more guy comes along who reminds her when she asks for it, she’s not going to be thinking that it’s him who doesn’t understand reality.

    Guys studying or teaching PUA don’t need to “project” their experiences of living in the feminist world and think that it’s a natural part of being female to reject men for putting them, the girls, in their place, with logic or otherwise.

    Cultures can and do convince 20 year olds that they will be old maids if they turn 21 without a husband.


    • YaReally
      on August 8, 2012 at 5:41 pm
      Original Link

      “Guys studying or teaching PUA don’t need to “project” their experiences of living in the feminist world and think that it’s a natural part of being female to reject men for putting them, the girls, in their place, with logic or otherwise.”

      I hear ya, and you not being in North America makes your report make more sense, but you have to understand that most pickup info is written for guys who are stuck in countries with the Sex & The City culture. The same way someone teaching boxing is going to be teaching you how to beat a boxer, not how to beat up a kid who’s never taken a swing in his life.

      It doesn’t matter if that’s not how they naturally are, you have to deal with the reality of the how the situation is, not how the situation would naturally be.

      I wouldn’t say there isn’t anything we can learn from your report, if we travel to whatever country you’re in, but I’d say your experience isn’t applicable to the majority of guys reading this blog is all.

      Thanks for clarifying your report though, the details make it make more sense.



corvinus
on August 8, 2012 at 3:39 pm
Original Link

P.S. Anonymous, ironically, you’re dangerously close to being in the same box as one of her gay male friends; not fuckin’ and snipping at each other for entertainment. Just sayin’.

Gay guys, from what I have gathered, get practice fucks from their fag hags a lot. CH had some post up about male animals that imitate females to get laid, and suggested that being gay is a way for omega humans to do that.

“Anonymous” {WARNING: Possible Troll Alert} recounts a self-described nuclear neg he dropped on a girl:

We could call him “Teal Cross” Anonymous, based on his gravatar.


  • YaReally
    on August 8, 2012 at 5:46 pm
    Original Link

    Some PUAs have experimented with pretending to be gay to girls to get in their pants, just to figure out the whole “can gay guys get laid?” thing.

    It works lol

    And we know the reasons why now (lots of Secret Society concepts and non-judgement concepts involved, their ASD never gets triggered by gay guys) but those guys were just fucking around for the sake of getting the knowledge/perspective of what’s going on in that dynamic, no PUA school really recommends pretending to be gay as a tactic lol


  • King A (Matthew King)
    on August 9, 2012 at 3:16 pm
    Original Link

    CH had some post up about male animals that imitate females to get laid

    Anyone who stoops to those tactics is metrosexual drifting past bi, skating close to the cliff of homo. Truly, this I will do anything for pussy mentality is a desperation that must inevitably devolve into a horror show without adopting reliable principles beyond vag hoarding. Like a guy who’d “suck just a little dick” — cuz hey, his girl thinks it’s “kinky” — being surprised one day to find himself bottoms-up on a gay porn set. Don’t worry, bro, no homo for crossing swords and dangling scrote as long as a female perineum is between our DP. Talk about a slippery slope, aided by astroglide. Imitating the fag is a Gayway Drug.

    Game needs to be rescued from metros. I mean: actually doing these things, whatever, you’ve already gone to the dark side. But rationally contemplating the deployment of these strategies on purpose? It corrupts rationality itself. A man simply do not envision these matters as possible, much less useful, much less desirable — unless there is something already queered within him. Men do not witness gayness in their midst and shrug. They twinge and taste vomitus, unless the acute revulsion factor has been weaned out of them by the forces of “toleration.” And here you go beyond witnessing to outright imitation.

    A garden without discrete boundaries is a jungle, first allowing the seeds of the wild to take root, and eventually being overrun by weeds.

    Matt


    • YaReally
      on August 15, 2012 at 4:54 am
      Original Link

      Oldschool PUAs were more concerned about fully understanding social dynamics and exploring the human psyche for the sake of collecting the knowledge to progress the art, than they were concerned about whether some non-contributing zero in a comment section thought they were “manly men”.

      People who don’t push boundaries are people who don’t advance the knowledge-base or technology.

      But I guess you’re content to be a negative leech too busy insulting other people’s hard work to bring anything new to the table yourself hey?



Scientific Proof That Women Love Drama

Original Link

via Heartiste

YaReally
on August 8, 2012 at 3:15 am
Original Link

lol’ed at the Tweet with the muscle dude forever alone in the pool. Esp with the skinny asiany looking guy behind him making 3 chicks laugh.

You can see the same thing play out pretty much any night out in any bar that has beefed up dudes in it. They don’t approach, they don’t get approached, and they get into fights outside the bar because they’re frustrated wondering why their muscled physique isn’t getting them pussy like society told them it would…maybe they need to cut another 2% body-fat, ya, that’s the ticket, back to the gym and the protein shakes!!! No seriously dude, I TOTALLY notice a difference when my body-fat is between 0.5% and 3% lower!!!11

(replace muscles with money, clothes, a car, a swank condo, etc. etc. in the above paragraph)

On relationship drama: It comes back to a woman wanting to feel /\/\/\/ instead of ———. If the relationship is too boring or too perfect (which are both basically too predictible) it’s a ——– so they get worked up about something that doesn’t even make sense just to get a rise out of you and get to feel /\/\/\/

This is also consistent with the principles behind the “Sex God Method”. It’s also why I like to escalate sex to kinky shit as fast as possible (preferably on the first bang, like the girl I’ve lined up to choke and slap around this weekend lol). Since I can’t be bothered to get worked up about silly girl drama in a relationship in general (because I know I can go out and find new girls easily), I can’t provide the /\/\/\/ as a boyfriend/date…but in the bedroom I can push the kink and she gets her /\/\/\/ fix because I run her through a shitload of emotions 50 Shades of Grey style.



Lem
on August 8, 2012 at 8:11 am
Original Link

“Women love drama”

Here is the scenario:

Have been using eye contact game on this cute 25 year old, on one occasion she was squirming in front of me in public centerfold style.

I am married and had last minute cold feet, as a result she feels rejected and probably suspects my internal beta reality.

Previously she would walk past my desk and give a delicious smile, well, just recently it’s all gone south, and yesterday her face was like the hammer of Thor.

Is this scenario recoverable?

PS, she is 25 I am 51, I would so love to bone her.

One or two other women have shown an interest too.

PPS, This web site has recently become PIG SLOW in firefox derivative Iceweasel. Any one else notice this?


  • YaReally
    on August 8, 2012 at 2:20 pm
    Original Link

    You didn’t do anything with the attention she gave you. Why would she give it to you again?

    (not saying you should cheat on your wife by shitting where you eat with a co-worker (that’d be a shit-show) but this is what her subconscious is thinking)



Hypocrites & Little Emperors

Original Link

via Rational Male

YaReally
on August 7th, 2012 at 11:42 pm
Original Link

“I have enough experience and Game savvy to where I can bang a different chick every night of the week with some reliability…so it’s somewhat EASY for me to say “It’s about you, not the chicks !””

This is why I stress going out and putting in field time and setting goals and using routines and putting in effort. I even recommend hyper-focusing on it for a while. Because while game is easy for me now, I still remember very clearly what it was like when I started out and the shitty “Just work on yourself and the girls will come” advice would have been no more useful than the “Just be yourself” advice girls gave me back then.

The irony is that “just be yourself” is accurate, it’s just that you have to go through a lot to understand what that actually means when you’re starting out from a beta headspace. Ultimately in the game you come full-circle back to where you started, but it’s like playing a videogame a second time through and having all the stats and skills you finished it with on the first play-thru.

“When another guy wins by not playing by the first guy’s rules he then needs to invalidate that win.”

Thus the guys who harp on how you need money (because they’re chasing money or have plans to make lots of money in the future where they envision they’ll have their harem), a 6-pack, drink alcohol, have a nice car, etc. to get the hot girls.

In their heads it’s “but I’m following the rules!! I know this is right, I’ve dedicated most of my life to it so I can’t be wrong or I’d be an idiot! That guy over there shitting all over my rules and getting the success I’ve been working toward must be lying, or a scammer, or he’s only fucking hammered low-quality bar sluts, or blah blah blah”

This is again why PUAs ignore the gay “scientific studies” done by keyboard jockey nerds in ivory towers under unrealistic conditions that aren’t even targeted at asking the right questions…because we’re out there regularly shitting all over their “theories”.

The hardest thing to accept about pickup is how easy it ultimately is.


Pregnant Pause Game

Original Link

via Heartiste

YaReally
on August 3, 2012 at 2:09 pm
Original Link

“Recommended daily allowance? Infinity percent!”

Fucking lol’ed at this line. The exclamation mark sells it. Oh hey you know what percent of that thing you should have? …INFINITY PERCENT!! lololol

..I’m not drunk. Yet.



drunk88
on August 3, 2012 at 3:47 pm
Original Link

lol you people are idiots. True I’m a guy, but if another guy tried this “pause” shit with me and took breaks, I’d leave the conversation at once. It’s deeply offensive, a lot of the stuff recommended here. I have no doubt it works on insecure twats, but posts like the one about Breaking Bad, are you kidding me, that’s called an *asshole* and no self-respecting man puts up with talking to a guy who makes pauses like that or who talks too slow. Also if a girl makes pauses while talking to me, I get rid of her.

A gap in a conversation is a failure of the conversation, and a sign that something is wrong. If I suspect motivations like the ones in this post, that means that your interlocutor is trying to tool you and it’s time to leave. I also don’t put up with men talking too slow or with other “alpha” behavior, this shit will get you beaten up or at least ostracized if you’re in an environment that’s not SWPL.

Most of the stuff on this blog is stuff that would get you beaten up in an environment with real men. It’s why the definition of “alpha” is so relative, to SWPL environment. In most other places you have to know how to throw a punch if you’re going to try strutting like this especially in front of other men. You’re not picking up any girls when you’re picking your teeth off the floor brah…


  • YaReally
    on August 3, 2012 at 5:44 pm
    Original Link

    “True I’m a guy, but if another guy tried this “pause” shit with me and took breaks, I’d leave the conversation at once.”

    No you wouldn’t, if they were congruent to it. Like an old guy with a Godfather vibe. Or a cop with authority questioning you.

    I’m not saying you’re full of shit though, because you WOULD be able to sniff out guys who are incongruent to doing this very quickly and would be weirded out by them. You’re just lumping everyone into one category, the same way girls lump guys into “any guy who tried that PUA stuff on me, I’d tell them to fuck off”.

    “A gap in a conversation is a failure of the conversation, and a sign that something is wrong.”

    Gaps in conversation are perfectly normal. Or when you’re chilling on your buddy’s patio with a beer or hanging out with your live-in GF or wife do you talk 24/7 like a used car salesman? No? You mean there are times where you can chill with them and the silence isn’t awkward?

    “I also don’t put up with men talking too slow or with other “alpha” behavior”

    Maybe you should cut back on the Redbulls lol

    “this shit will get you beaten up”

    No it won’t. Now you’re just being stupid.

    “or at least ostracized”

    No it won’t.

    “if you’re in an environment that’s not SWPL.”

    I definitely can’t think of any chill alpha black guys who talk slow with lots of pauses. They’re all like Chris Tucker, right?

    “Most of the stuff on this blog is stuff that would get you beaten up in an environment with real men.”

    You’re an idiot, and I take girls off guys like you regularly.

    “In most other places you have to know how to throw a punch if you’re going to try strutting like this especially in front of other men.”

    Alpha respects alpha. As long as you’re congruent. I’ve gamed girls and befriended guys in biker bars, cowboy bars, and plenty of non-white clubs/bars (with asian/brown gangs).

    If you’re getting punched, it’s because you’re giving off a shitty vibe.

    “You’re not picking up any girls when you’re picking your teeth off the floor brah…”

    Wow, I bet you train UFC!!!!11 How many TapOut shirts do you have?

    http://i3.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/007/508/watch-out-we-got-a-badass-over-here-meme.png



Eye Contact Game

Original Link

via Heartiste

A.B. Dada
on August 1, 2012 at 1:11 pm
Original Link

For the first time in my life, I’ve been trying public transportation. I mean, EVERWHERE I am — international travel, in the cities I live in, in US cities I visit. Before this year, I have taken less than a handful of buses, trains, etc.

I’ve always been good at eye-contact “day game.” It’s never been a problem for me to just walk up, hold my posture and eye contact without being Mr. Creepy, keep that wry smile going, and open a gal on the street.

When a bus is starting and stopping, or a train is jostling about, or a subway goes from light to dark due to external tunnel lights, my composure completely collapses.

I’ve tripped, fallen against a handhold pole, and outright just caused myself to break out into laughter just trying to keep my posture straight.

A gal looks at me at a bar? That’s easy — go up to her and say something funny.

A gal looks at me on a train, even turns her body a bit to face mine? I’m at a loss


  • YaReally
    on August 1, 2012 at 5:10 pm
    Original Link

    “my composure completely collapses.”

    That’s because you’re too concerned with looking cool. Your ego is saying “if I can’t approach this smooth and perfect, then I’m not doing it!!” This is similar to a guy who won’t approach unless he has his best shirt on and his hair done perfectly, etc. It’s very limiting and will fuck you out of a lot of awesome opportunities.

    The cure is to fuck your ego in the face by purposely making an ass of yourself lol ie – approach these girls, regardless of what the train is doing. Make a joke about the situation, or a joke about how un-smooth your approach was, etc. Basically show your ego that you don’t care if you’re not James Bond, you’ll force yourself to approach regardless of how embarrassing it might be, so it might as well get with the program and quit holding you back.

    You actually have a huge internal-game learning/growth opportunitiy right in front of you, if you reach out and take it. :)


    • A.B. Dada
      on August 1, 2012 at 5:15 pm
      Original Link

      Oh, I agree — my perspective is in line with what you said above. It’s just a curious and interesting situation to think that at my age, I can find a completely foreign playground to me, and let it get under my skin.

      On a non-moving platform, my posture and composure don’t matter to me, they’re already out of my thinking, but stick me on a train or bus and all of a sudden I’m self-concerned froma vanity standpoint, which is not how I am in any other situation.

      It amazes me how much draw there is on public transportation. I wish I had tried my hand at it years ago. Sober women with jobs and students galore? Hell yeah.


      • throaway
        on August 1, 2012 at 5:35 pm
        Original Link

        One morning on the train, I watched this dude get shot-down hard. The two girls he was trying to open simply turned their backs and giggled to themselves, causing a twitter of approval from women in the crowd. The guy turned beet red once he realized that 50 people were staring at him in complete silence. I’d say avoid the commuters and bring your balls of steel.


        • YaReally
          on August 1, 2012 at 6:13 pm
          Original Link

          Social pressure in action. It’ll cave pretty much anyone no matter how tough they act lol


      • YaReally
        on August 1, 2012 at 6:12 pm
        Original Link

        You might want to read Paul Janka’s e-Book (it’s free):

        http://www.pauljanka.com/downloads/GettingLaidInNYC.pdf

        He focuses on daygame in NYC where everyone takes public transportation and there are hot girls “on the go” all day. He does a lot of subway/train/etc. game. He differs from most PUAs in that he approaches during the week, collecting numbers, and then goes on dates with those girls on Fri/Sat nights instead of competing in the meat markets against bitch-shields with all the other guys.

        You might find his style suits your current situation.


  • Rayge
    on August 1, 2012 at 6:23 pm
    Original Link

    As important as it is, as a man, to be independent and self-possessed, we are still social animals. You subconsciously calibrate to your social surroundings, regardless of what they are.

    In a bar the goal is to socialize, to strengthen existing relationships and engage in new ones. This goal is reflected in the actions of all the patrons, their posture, voice tone, in the way they make and break eye contact. All this comes together to create a “vibe” that, like it or not, you cannot escape. In a bar this vibe loosens you up, and strengthens your game. Add alcohol to the mix, even if you aren’t drinking, and the vibe bolsters your confidence even more.

    On public transport the goal is to get somewhere. Few people have an interest in making momentary subway pals, and few the charisma to do so smoothly and regularly. There is an air of distrust, postures are closed, eye contact is avoided, and talk is hushed. The vibe is cold, and you become cold with it. Confidence and charm are difficult to maintain in the atmosphere, and if you add in a fear of collision (which it seems you do), they become more difficult still.

    Surroundings effect everyone. Even the sperg who clams up at a bar is responding to the open vibe, they just respond in their spergy way.

    Bars also offer an element of static social value. If you are with friends, you are ensconced in an established social hierarchy. You may consciously know you are an alpha stud, but without immediate social reinforcement that value is harder to maintain internally. Even without friends, bars still offer a degree of social value. Unless you are immediately recognized as a creep (e.g. horrible posture, wasted alone, talking to yourself, shoegazing), it is generally accepted you belong there. You can afford the clothing befitting the milieu, you can afford drinks, you enjoy socializing enough to be out drinking instead of drinking beer in front of the TV.

    Public transport immediately strips everyone of social value. The only way to combat this is through appearance. Obviously expensive clothing is a good defense, as is good skin, physique, hair, and posture. But even if you can visually establish yourself as the highest value person on the bus, your value relative to an onlookers own social circle is nebulous. This uncertainty takes a toll on your composure. We are evolved to live in a static community throughout most of our lives, along with a well established social standing. Being stripped of that standing every time you step on a bus takes a toll few people recognize.

    Fun experiment: next time you are waiting in line at the bank, look at how uncomfortable everyone is.You will notice frequent weight shifting, lots of awkward looking around, tapping fingers, and an unusually large percentage of people will have their arms crossed. Then notice how uncomfortable you are yourself. Its contagious. Banks are almost always like this. Tellers have a positional authority (access to financial info, potential to bear bad news, always well dressed, and that protective counter separating them from the unwashed depositors) that is subconsciously disruptive to the customers. If the tellers are mostly young and fuckable, its twitch city for the whole line.

    All that being said: Get a more solid frame, and you will be fine. You cannot avoid the vibe, but you can still smother it with your gargantuan leathery sack. Fill the ensuing void with chest hair and intoxicating man musk, and others will flock to your poon-hunting lodge vibe.


    • A.B. Dada
      on August 1, 2012 at 6:36 pm
      Original Link

      My ability to land a gal isn’t a problem. I’ve never been single in my life, and usually have a few plates spinning either actively or in the background.

      I was just reporting that the public transportation system is a new venue for me. I’ve been dating for 25 years, riding trains and buses for just a few months.

      As to people being cold on trains, I don’t see it at all. I’ve met a few people (I own some print shops and wear my own line of t-shirts and people always comment on the design or cut of the cloth), made a few friends, got some numbers of dames, etc.

      I don’t do night bar game because I don’t find women who drink excessively attractive. None of my regular plates are drinkers, but they’re great women. I prefer day game, and it’s always been coffee shops or lunch eating or the like.

      Public trans appears to be a reasonable place for a practiced and confident day gamer to test his talents. It’s a different atmosphere for me, but just in the past few months, I’ve definitely seen that it’s not just people trying to get from A to B in private.


      • Rayge
        on August 1, 2012 at 7:04 pm
        Original Link

        I’m not questioning your abilities, just hoping to bring light to some of your troubles. If you are as skilled as you say, and I have no reason to doubt that, then why does this particular venue trip you up?

        It would be foolish of me to claim that no one on public transport is open to being friendly. I think its clear, however, that the majority of people are isolated and in travel mode. I am claiming that these people have a pronounced effect on your state, even though you may not even be aware they are there.

        Have you ever had your attention grabbed by someone mentioning your name in a nearby conversation? You don’t need to be listening, or even aware the conversation is happening, for that to occur. You track EVERYTHING that is happening around you, but are only aware of a fraction of it.

        Just because you don’t notice that awkward teenager plugged into his ipod and video game two rows back, doesn’t mean he isn’t affecting you.

        There are a couple other hurdles to public transport. One, you have an audience. A lot of people are sitting idly, and will immediately start watching you as you approach. Stage fright is hard to overcome. Two, you have no exit strategy. If things go wrong, you have to sit with the embarrassment until it is your stop. You may not be aware of either of these, but your subconscious is.

        Observe yourself and your surroundings closely next time you are on public transport, I think you will find my ideas have merit.


        • Mr. Pointyface
          on August 1, 2012 at 7:43 pm
          Original Link

          Mr. Pointyface hereby issues a verdict in ABDADA’S favor here. Bars are not some rarified special location where the elite hone their eliteness.

          Too many alcohol abusers and alcoholics.

          The super-elite chick who only has time for productive shit — which definitely will include hot, nasty fucking with a trusted lover/abuser–will be at a cultural event or tied to her antique four-poster telling you the filthiest things you can imagine, inciting you to licentious behavior. She meets elite guys at the coool events she goes to, or at random when ABDADA types break convention.

          Case dismissed.


          • YaReally
            on August 1, 2012 at 9:35 pm
            Original Link

            “Bars are not some rarified special location where the elite hone their eliteness.”

            We just encourage bars/nightclubs because girls dress their hottest (and thus look their most intimidating) when they go to those places, and there are hundreds of women to hone your skills on in a small area, and you have to deal with WAY more factors than in daygame (cockblocks, bitch-shields, loud music, club-stimuli, etc.). So if you can handle yourself in a nightclub, doing daygame is laughably easy because all the difficult stuff is removed. It’s like training with weights on.

            In most cities doing daygame means spending 20 minutes looking for a set, which for new guys makes it really hard to keep your momentum going. In a bar if you get blown out you just turn around and say “hello” to the girl behind you.

            But I agree that the really high quality girls aren’t getting hammered at bars and doing coke in the bathroom.

            Same time, you can find high quality chicks at the bar who don’t drink or do drugs and are just there because they’re part of high value social circles. The stereotype of every girl at the bar being a drunk coke-whore is revealed as bullshit when you go out and meet enough of them. Hell, a lot of really hot girls don’t even drink more than a couple drinks when they’re out because they don’t want to get sloppy and go home with some loser or ruin their reputation among their social circle lol

            I think as you get older, too, you tend to start looking more at daygame, and social circle connections (ie – the “coool events she goes to”).



That Guy
on August 1, 2012 at 3:02 pm
Original Link

Reminds me of an encounter I had years ago. I had just started working at a new job and it’s Friday evening and a female colleague has invited her gf to visit the city and her gf has just dropped by our workplace. I rounded a set of cubicles to see this gorgeous girl sitting on a chair, brunette, blue eyes, all tits and ass, solid 8. We simultaneously locked eyes and just stared at each other for 30-40 seconds, then I say:
Me: “Well aren’t you going to introduce yourself?”
Hottie:”Hmm… hi!” (nervously)
Me: (Walk directly to her, not breaking eye contact. Hold out my hand) “Stephen… and you are?
Hottie: “Jane”
Me: (shaking hand) “Glad to meet you Jane” (continue on my way out of the building)

Next week, Monday or Tuesday, my colleague is on a call and I hear her saying the name “Jane”, so I round the cubes and say:
Me: (holding out hand) “Give me the phone”
Girl: “What?? I’m on a call!”
Me: “Give me the phone”
Girl: “But, I’m talking to my girlfriend”
Me: “I know… give me the phone”
Girl: (hands me the phone, smiling sheepishly)
Me: “Hi Jane, I’m that guy you met Friday, when are you in town again? We should talk…” (droll, dispassionate voice)
Hottie: “Oh… ah… Hi! Well, I’m not sure… maybe in a few weeks?!” (anxiously)
Me: “See you then!” (hand phone back to colleague)

Of course, later that day, my colleague tells me that her gf actually realized she had to do some shopping in town, and so would actually be back later in the week! When she arrived one evening after work, I just acted like we had a date, and just said, “OK, let’s go to x for drinks”, and we did and then went to an apartment of a friend of hers and got to know each other much better in the fire escape – that very night.


  • YaReally
    on August 1, 2012 at 6:14 pm
    Original Link

    Solid.



Adrian
on August 1, 2012 at 3:12 pm
Original Link

Any thoughts on this happening in a foreign country when she is expecting you to be a local? In other words, walking up to her and speaking English may or may not spoil the moment…


  • YaReally
    on August 1, 2012 at 5:46 pm
    Original Link

    A while back Tyler was encouraging guys to try approaching without talking:

    “I’ve also mentioned exactly what I figured out that helped me so much — simply NOT TALKING until makeout. Try this over and over for a few hours and see what it teaches you. Absolutely unbelievable what you’re forced to figure out — key: don’t give into the temptation to talk to a girl whose into you but won’t makeout, move on and keep trying again and again until you’re getting it consistently.”

    Someone trying it out:

    “When you stop verbalizing, your forced to game with only non-verbals (eye contact and physicality). I thought I was good at non-verbals but not speaking took it to the next level.

    Your sense of entitlement increases because, she expects you to react and say something but no, your not gonna say shit. Its great when you see a hottie going on a monologue to win you over when all you have done is just stand there. lol.

    The biggest thing it did for me was get rid of this little need to “do something.” Like, I’m in a set and I feel that I need to “do something” to get the girl to the next level. Like, be more gamie. But, now I just don’t act and just give her solid EC. No actions, just EC. Works great cuz she sees how comfortable I am.”

    “… you don’t just walk up to her and stand there. You walk up to her and engage her physically and with Eye contact.”

    He first mentioned it a long time ago as the “plant and stare” opener: http://www.pualingo.com/openers/plant-ans-stare-opener/

    I’m sure you can figure out how this applies to gaming in a foreign country where you don’t speak the language lol



YaReally
on August 1, 2012 at 5:04 pm
Original Link

“Getting strong eye contact from a girl before approaching — an approach I would NOT classify as a cold approach”

Correct. This is a “Warm Approach”, and eye-contact is an “Approach Invite” (AI). If she purposely stands near you or in your line-of-sight as well, that’s pAImAI (pre-Approach Invitation, male-Approach Invitation). All of these make the set much easier than a legit Cold Approach.

“is something many beta males rely upon because it is, in fact, one of the easiest approaches to execute.”

I just want to point out that the VAST majority of Naturals rely on this too. That’s often why you see Naturals go home with really hot girls but also with really ugly girls…because they’re waiting for an Approach Invitation, so if they get it from the hot girl, awesome, it’s on, but if the hot girl is oblivious to them and they only get the AI from an ugly girl, well hey, it’s better than going home alone!

I was actually really surprised at this when I first started hanging out with Naturals, I just assumed that they approached any girl but a lot of them are chickenshit unless the set is a Warm Approach. One of my buddies will just stare a girl he likes down until she finally turns to face him and notices him and locks eyes and THEN he’ll go in. This is also why a lot of Naturals appear to have a really high success rate…they’re not approaching randoms, they’re approaching sets where the odds are stacked in their favor.

They get VERY good at detecting REALLY tiny Approach Invites that most guys would never notice, because that’s the bread and butter of how they get laid.

I actually picked up a lot of bad habits hanging with Naturals that I’m STILL trying to fix and unwire from my brain…when I started out as a PUA I was able to Cold Approach ANYONE, no set was off-limits to me. But now from hanging out with Naturals who won’t go into a set until they get an Approach Invite, I tend to hestiate and not approach unless the set is Warm. I have to consciously kick my own ass to not fall into that trap now…I didn’t even realize I was DOING this for probably a year lol Now that I know what’s going on I can fix it, but man, it really set my skills back a lot.

A guy who can Cold Approach even if he has a low success rate is infinitely more impressive to me than a Natural who only Warm Approaches with a high success rate…because most of us got into pickup to have choice. We wanted to be able to see that hot girl from across the room and go “That’s for me, that’s what I want.” and go over and chat her up whether she knew we were alive or not. Guys who only Warm Approach are trapped in the cage of “I can only choose from the girls who choose me first”.

Far as Direct VS Indirect off a Warm Approach goes:

Direct is great, especially if she’s solo (tho it can work fine in a group, but that’s more of a gamble because sometimes her friends will just fade off into the background and let her hook up, but if they don’t then who knows what her friends will throw at you lol).

But Indirect has it’s merits and isn’t necessarily beta in this situation. The thing guys have to understand though, is that once you lock eyes with the girl and then place yourself near her, even if you’re being indirect, she KNOWS you two locked eyes. She knows the indirect stuff is just a ruse. And she knows that YOU know SHE knows the indirect stuff is a ruse. What happens then is that there’s two levels of communication going on…there’s the “I’m pretending not to hit on you” level where you’re doing your indirect shit and this is all her friends see/notice, but then there’s also the “…but we both know I AM hitting on you ;) ” level underneath it where only you and her know about this level going on.

This can build a LOT of sexual tension for her because she knows you’re going to make a move, and she knows you know she knows you’re going to make a move, but you’re not making it yet because you’re confident enough not to rush things…so she wonders what your game is and if you’re actually going to make the move and when you’re going to focus on her and all this confusion and drama in her head is exciting and gets her gina tingling. She sees you casually chatting her friends up and not even looking at her but she KNOWS you know she’s there…”When is he going to talk to meeeee???? Omg my friend loves him, he’s not into HER is he? We made eye contact, he has to be into me!! Omg omg omg” and then when you finally turn your attention to her, BAM, it’s on like donkey kong because of all the build-up.

So ya, indirect has it’s merits. But only if you understand there’s that second level of subcommunication going on during a Warm Approach. If you get an Approach Invite, but you go in thinking it’s exactly like a pure Cold Approach, you won’t have that “we both know we’re going to fuck eachother later ;) ” subcommunication and you’ll come off as beta and lose the girl.

Nuances. It’s all about nuances. The nuances you learn when you go out a lot and try different styles of game. It’s almost Friday, make some plans to go out this weekend. :)


  • evilalpha
    on August 1, 2012 at 7:05 pm
    Original Link

    I really like what you’re saying, but the definition of “natural” is the ability to engage strangers not the ability to pick a friendly face in the crowd. I can crack people up in elevators. I think you should use a different word than “natural”


    • YaReally
      on August 1, 2012 at 7:25 pm
      Original Link

      They can engage strangers too, but I’m talking about when they’re on the hunt for pussy, not elevator buddies. :) Your definition of a Natural is more what I’d just call a charismatic person.

      http://www.pualingo.com/pua-definitions/natural/


      • evilalpha
        on August 1, 2012 at 8:01 pm
        Original Link

        And I’m talking about both engaging strangers and hunting for pussy.

        Naturals don’t need a green light to hunt pussy from strangers, make elevator buddies from strangers, or hunt pussy from strangers in elevators. Waiting for an opening is not what defines “natural”


        • YaReally
          on August 1, 2012 at 9:25 pm
          Original Link

          You can define the word however you want, but for the sake of the discussion of “guys who are good with girls”, a Natural is a guy who naturally does well with women. All I’m saying is that if you observe these guys you’ll notice that a lot of them prefer not to Cold Approach. That doesn’t mean they don’t have any skills and couldn’t handle a cold approach if they had to, it just means that they prefer a very specific set of circumstances where they feel like they have an advantage.


  • PDX
    on August 1, 2012 at 7:49 pm
    Original Link

    Couple of thoughts:

    - Not a big fan of the direct approach in a group dynamic. Even with a solid AI, your direct opener is going to perk the ears of the resident cock-block. If the target is already interested, not much of a need to push your chips all-in from the get-got.

    - I don’t like going out with naturals for the very reasons you mentioned. Whenever I see a set to cold approach, I get excuses of why I shouldn’t (too young, look bitchy, girls night out, etc.). It’s either negativity I have to resist, or I will approach and warm them up, only to then have to deal with the natural throwing salt in my game. (Yes, wingman rules apply, but naturals can and do compete with vibe alone.)


    • YaReally
      on August 1, 2012 at 9:46 pm
      Original Link

      “Not a big fan of the direct approach in a group dynamic. Even with a solid AI, your direct opener is going to perk the ears of the resident cock-block.”

      Personally I agree, but this CAN be made to work. Like I say, it just requires that you mentally keep track of the cockblocks and what they’re doing. As long as they don’t care about you, you’re good, but the second you ping on their radar, you have to POUNCE on them and introduce yourself first and show you’re not a threat/loser. If you wait for them to go “Hey, who’re you?”, you’re already coming off socially inept and/or rude to them. Even if they don’t directly interfere while you talk to her, they’ll cockblock you if things start going too well (ie – she wants to leave with you or give you her number, etc.).

      But if you go in direct on your girl, and immediately handle the cockblocks (build some comfort/rapport with them, Juggler style), once they approve of you they’ll leave you alone and you can resume with your girl.

      This requires being able to handle group dynamics and shit though, so it’s difficult for newbies to pull off and sends their conversation rates into the shitter as girls that like them keep getting pulled away from them by the group lol

      “Whenever I see a set to cold approach, I get excuses of why I shouldn’t (too young, look bitchy, girls night out, etc.). It’s either negativity I have to resist”

      lol this is so true. It took me a while to learn to ignore this shit. All they’re doing is covering up that they’re too pussy to go for it by trying to make you think that it’s an impossible set and no one could do it. That’s way easier on their ego than admitting that it could totally be done but they don’t have the balls, since for a Natural the most important thing is protecting his ego and making sure his buddies all think he’s awesome (thus the Natural’s tendencies to constantly talk about the girls they’re seeing, banging, etc.).

      The ironic part is that if the guy ends up stumbling INTO that set (like a girl from it approaches him), and it goes well, he’ll then rewrite history entirely in his head and be like “ya I knew that was on from the start!” even if you’re like “…but you said it was a no-go!!”. It’s fucking funny but frustrating sometimes lol

      “or I will approach and warm them up, only to then have to deal with the natural throwing salt in my game. (Yes, wingman rules apply, but naturals can and do compete with vibe alone.)”

      lol also SO true. They’re not necessarily TRYING to blow you out, but it just happens because of their vibe…plus since they instinctively escalate when a girl shows them Indicators of Interest, they just find the situation has escalated. Much like women backwards-rationalizing, Naturals will look back on situations like this and to them it honestly “just HAPPENED!”

      All of this tones down the more you hang around them and get to understand their psyche, but when you first start hanging out with them, especially when you’re still a newbie to game, it’s really frustrating lol



YaReally
on August 1, 2012 at 5:28 pm
Original Link

Skip to around 50 seconds in when he gets introduced to the girl.

Shit to notice:

- he makes eye-contact, then checks her out quick, then keeps holding the eye-contact right up to the kiss

- listen to how he slows down “this’ your..first….day………” like he’s stunned by her and like he knows the indirect words he’s saying don’t even matter

- notice they don’t shake hands and let go, they keep holding hands. I use this one a lot when I meet girls, I’ll just lightly keep holding their hand (nice and loose so they’re free to pull away if they want to). If they don’t pull away, they’re into me. I’ve had situs where we’ve held our shaking hands for like 30 seconds to where it’s awkward and I can joke about it.

Most guys will watch that clip and go “well he’s famous so he can do that” but this goes back to what I said in an above comment about Naturals being able to spot Approach Invites that most guys are oblivious to. She was giving him the eye and he picked up on it hella fast and escalated. Maybe she wouldn’t be giving him the eye if he wasn’t famous, but we all run into girls now and then who eye-fuck us and could do the exact same thing he’s doing despite not being celebrities.

Once he knows the sexual tension is through the roof from the indirect, he goes direct and escalates it.

In the moment it looks chaotic and unexpected and random to everyone else, but to him it was completely logical and paint-by-numbers.


  • YaReally
    on August 1, 2012 at 5:30 pm
    Original Link

    oops, actually the first eyes he makes with her here are at 40 seconds in. They may have eye-fucked earlier in the day too, but we’ll never know. The point is this isn’t as random as it seems at first.



first time caller
on August 1, 2012 at 9:54 pm
Original Link

I can’t remember where I read it, but someone had a good opener after some intense eye contact. You walk up to the girl and say, “You can’t look at me like that and not say anything”.

I’ve never tried it but it sounds pretty legit.


  • YaReally
    on August 2, 2012 at 3:31 am
    Original Link

    It’s legit. I’ve used it a shitload. It’s my default opener for this situ.



A girl's perspective
on August 1, 2012 at 11:51 pm
Original Link

I’m a girl and IMO, the problem with your suggested openers is that they sound über-douchey.. Unless your confidence is off the chain and u have ‘moves like jagger’ most guys aren’t pulling this off without eliciting eye rolls and ‘weirdo’ looks. No one talks like this. (well the one about if u wanted to talk to me, u should have come over is kinda cute) I wouldn’t recommend these for beginners. I’d suggest more casual normal convo. Like if she’s sitting at the bar and it’s busy, say something like ‘geez what do I have to do to get this bartenders attention?’ or ask her if it would be girly if you ordered a mojito, etc. Or like some people said, if she’s reading something on a phone/kindle, u could say “looks interesting, what are u reading?” etc. Keep it basic. If it comes off too rehearsed or contrived, girls are going to be looking like ‘huh?’ ‘you talking to me?’

I was at a bar in Boston over the weekend, and I was trying to get a drink and there was this platform thing under the bar so I stood on it to get the bartenders attention. The guy next to me looked up at me and stepped up on the platform too and leaned in and said something like “Hey good idea, maybe ill get a drink now… hey I’m ‘John’ by the way, whats ur name?” etc. etc. I have a boyfriend but I thought it was a casual/natural/unoffensive way to open and he seemed like a cool guy I might have talked to otherwise.

Whenever guys approach me with horrible game its mainly due to bad timing. Like if I have my earphones on (which I often do since I live in NYC) coming up and trying to strike up a conversation out of the blue, I’m gonna be scrambling to turn down the volume or press pause and Ive already missed the first part of whatever you were trying to say. Then when you go to repeat it and its some corny a$$ sh*t or out of the blue question I’m going to be either confused or annoyed. Also guys tend to ask too many what I call “filler” questions too early in the convo like “so, do you work around here? Oh you do, what do you do there? How long have you been working there, do you like it, etc. To me, you’re still a complete stranger and I’m not quite ready to start telling you my whole life story and likes/dislikes within the first five minutes of convo. Especially when you haven’t even got to the point yet like “hey, Im so-and-so, do you have a business card, maybe we could grab lunch one day” etc. So all while ur running down ur list of filler questions, in my head, I’m like, ok, please just get to the part where u ask me if I have a boyfriend or whatever so I can get rid of you. You should make your intentions known from the gate or at least get the flirting/playful vibe going cause every girl knows that if a guy is sitting there asking a bunch of questions whats eventually coming.. Youre just drawing it out unnecessarily and I have no incentive to keep engaging you if you’re ‘hiding your hand’ so to speak out of fear or nervousness.

I know my comments wont be popular and the word bitch/cunt will be quick to be tossed around.. I’m just keeping it real from a girl’s perspective.


  • YaReally
    on August 2, 2012 at 3:34 am
    Original Link

    “You should make your intentions known from the gate”

    This is why I just to up and slap them across the face with my cock. Fuck it, let’s save time!!



Nathan
on August 2, 2012 at 12:45 am
Original Link

Ok, beta male here with a few questions:
1) Does anyone have any good advice on how to improve maintaining eye contact? I have been trying to work on this, but when an attractive girl makes eye contact with me, I instinctively look away.
2) There’s a cute girl I work with who, whenever we are walking past each other, she makes direct eye contact with me and quickly looks off to the side when I make eye contact back. What should I read into this?
3) What does it mean when a girl goes out of her way to avoid eye contact? And, I’m not talking about in a club situation. I have an ex who I still run into often and even when she is talking to me for prolonged periods of time, she makes a conscious effot to not look me in the eyes. It just seems weird.


  • Special K
    on August 2, 2012 at 12:56 pm
    Original Link

    1: Try this. For the next two weeks, actively seek to make eye-contact with everyone who crosses your path. Man or woman, stranger or family. As soon as you get the contact HOLD IT. No matter how uncomfortable it gets, keep staring at them until they look away.

    Just doing this for a day or two really makes you feel like a champ. Staring someone in the eye till they submit and look away is an ego-boost. Knowing you can do it to practically everyone you meet is positively exhilarating. After two weeks the behavior starts to become automatic, and will override your previous impulse to look away. When you find yourself having to remember to break eye-contact rather than to hold it is when you know you’re all the way there.

    2: Green fuckin light dude! Make your move.

    3: Usually a complete refusal to make eye-contact means shame. Either she’s ashamed of how she treated you, or she’s ashamed she ever dated you in the first place.

    Side note: In the former case you can easily get sex if you figure out what specifically she’s ashamed of. The technique is to IOI her, then use the shame to DLV her as soon as she starts responding to the IOI. It’s crazy easy to do. Problem is it gets you guilt-inspired sex with an ex. Not really worth it unless you need to break a dry spell.


    • YaReally
      on August 2, 2012 at 5:05 pm
      Original Link

      Just to add to this cause he’s new:

      - make sure you’re smiling or it’ll look threatening, especially to dudes (down the road when you have way more social calibration you can do it to men and women without smiling and not be threatening)

      - skip guys, don’t bother making eye contact with random guys on the street for a few months till you have making eye contact with girls down solid. Being able to stare guys down is good for your confidence in general as a man but at this newbie stage it’s more trouble than it’s worth and the elation you’ll feel from staring a super hot girl down will do way more for you than staring down some dude. Again, down the road you can do it, when you have more social calibration, but stick to girls for now.

      - if you’re passing eachother and neither of you breaks eye contact, simply say “hello”. Never know where that will lead.

      - if she’s stuck in one spot like sitting on the subway, don’t keep staring at her after the initial volley. All you care about right now is “winning” that initial eye contact lock. Staring for a long time without approaching gets creepy.

      - if you “lose” the initial volley (you look away first, especially if you look down), don’t bother trying again with her. You only get one shot at this with each girl, they learn everything about what kind of man you are, how confident you are, and how attracted they could be to you from that little 5 second exchange.

      Have fun. :)


  • YaReally
    on August 2, 2012 at 4:52 pm
    Original Link

    1) Keep doing it until you don’t flinch. Embrace the awkward feeling.

    2) She wants to fuck you.

    3) She wants to fuck you but she’s embarrassed about it.



Ministry of Public Enlightenment and Propaganda, D.R.G.
on August 2, 2012 at 2:42 am
Original Link

When I receive strong eye contact, I find it best to approach the girl directly rather than chat up her friends after making my approach. In this situation, she’s basically giving you permission to go direct right then and there. Going the route of group dynamics isn’t necessarily a bad idea, but it risks slowing the natural momentum of the moment. If she’s with a group, I think it’s best to approach the girl directly, build a little rapport, and then befriend (read: neutralize) her gaggle so you can abscond into the night with your prize. A line that works for me is “Hey, I’m gonna kidnap your friend for a second. We’ll be right back.” I say this even if I have no intention of returning her; it’s just plausibility deniability for the group. (In fact, I find telling a girl I’m kidnapping her works ridiculously well for getting her to leave with me because in her mind it automatically “absolves” her whatever happens next.)

I think the significance of strong eye contact from across the room is understated in this scenario. In my experience, as often as not, strong distance eye contact means the girl is DTF provided your game matches your look. Feel free to escalate ten times faster than you would during a cold approach. Provided your frame is tight, it’s not unrealistic to leave with girl in tow within minutes after making your direct approach. If you have a wingman, he should occupy her friends if she has any and he can quickly identify them. I learned this the hard way…

I had just returned to the U.S. after several months of traveling throughout Southeast Asia. I was at a club in San Diego’s Gas Lamp district with two old military buddies. It was about midnight. I was talking with one of my buddies when I noticed a skinny Latina in a black dress eyefucking me. Hard. She appeared to be alone. A definite greenlight. I cut the conversation with my buddy and approached the girl directly, positioning my body between hers and the bar. Our bodies were practically against each other.

Paraphrasing:

Me: I saw you looking at me. But you should know I’m not a nice guy here to make friends.
Her: What are you here for?
Me: (Ignoring her question, or rather answering it physically, I placed two fingers under her chin and lifted/pulled her jaw towards mine and kissed her for about five seconds before breaking off the kiss.)
Me: Look. (pause) I wanna take you with me, but I don’t wanna watch TV, and I don’t wanna ‘hang out.’ You understand?
Her: Yeah.
Me: Are you sure?
Her: (slutty smile on face) Yeah.
Me: Let’s go.

I took the girls hand and started for the door. She obediently followed. I opened the club door to the street and felt the fresh downtown night air on my face. I was already smug, high on the knowledge that within fifteen minutes I would be balls deep in my prize. Then suddenly I was stopped in my tracks. I felt resistance and turned to see the girl’s two fat friends (I swear those bitches came out of nowhere) holding her left hand, literally anchoring her to the floor. I was given the standard “It’s girl’s night out and she’s leaving with us” refrain. I tried to smooth the situation over but the hogs were having none of it. The girls was embarrassed and sulked back with her hog friends, destined for a night of non-stop clamjamming.

Lesson learned: Go direct and escalate fast if you get strong distance eye contact. This is doubly true if the girl appears alone, tipsy, and it’s late into the night. Just beware of gorilla cockblockers in the mist and have an aware wingman who isn’t afraid to do a little poaching.


  • YaReally
    on August 2, 2012 at 5:14 pm
    Original Link

    “I was already smug, high on the knowledge that within fifteen minutes I would be balls deep in my prize. Then suddenly I was stopped in my tracks. I felt resistance and turned to see the girl’s two fat friends (I swear those bitches came out of nowhere) holding her left hand, literally anchoring her to the floor.”

    Fuckin lol’ed.

    http://alltheragefaces.com/img/faces/large/sad-i-know-that-feel-bro-l.png